#OSGEO IRC Log - 2009-12-09

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02:43:22 sigq: osgeofeed: Changeset [2764]: added sponsorship prospectus <http://trac.osgeo.org/osgeo/changeset/2764>
02:43:31 CIA-27: osgeo: lbecchi * r2764 /foss4g/2010/documents/sponsorship-prospectus-09122009.pdf: added sponsorship prospectus
05:54:19 sigq: osgeofeed: Changeset [2765]: refining registration page <http://trac.osgeo.org/osgeo/changeset/2765>
05:54:34 CIA-27: osgeo: lbecchi * r2765 /foss4g/2010/website/registration.php: refining registration page
06:29:52 FrankW: jmckenna: would you like me to help with the 2010 site issues?
06:30:17 jmckenna: FrankW: yes of course.
06:30:25 FrankW: Where were you planning to host it?
06:30:32 FrankW: osgeo1? xblade14?
06:30:54 jmckenna: I have no plan...am looking for recommendation from you. what is best?
06:30:57 FrankW: I'd be most comfortable putting it on xblade14 so Lorenzo can update it directly when he wants.
06:31:11 FrankW: I'll get going on it.
06:31:12 jmckenna: then that works..as long as he has access..great
06:31:24 FrankW: My internet and power is flakey so don't be offended if I just disappear.
06:31:25 jmckenna: thanks for doing that
06:31:39 FrankW: It is a snow day here.
06:31:46 jmckenna: ah i so hear
06:32:40 FrankW: I see the 2007 web site is under /osgeo/foss4g/foss4g2007-web.
06:32:50 FrankW: I'll put 2010 in the same /osgeo/foss4g directory.
06:32:57 jmckenna: sounds good
06:33:29 jmckenna: 2009 does live there also? hmm
06:33:43 jmckenna: doesn't
06:33:43 FrankW: I don't see 2009.
06:33:50 FrankW: I don't know where it lives.
06:33:52 jmckenna: ok. no big deal.
06:33:55 FrankW: I suppose I could figure that out.
06:34:15 jmckenna: well let's go with the proper location, what you suggested
06:34:36 FrankW: It looks like 2009 is on osgeo2, but it would less convenient to provide lorenzo access there.
06:35:00 jmckenna: xblade14 is good then
06:36:56 FrankW: Hmm, php.
06:37:09 jmckenna: i noticed that also
06:37:14 FrankW: I'm not certain of the status of php on this system.
06:37:24 FrankW: hopefully it will be straight forward.
06:38:13 FrankW: What urls do we want pointing here? http://2010.foss4g.org and http://foss4g2010.org??
06:38:14 sigq: Title: foss4g2010 ( at 2010.foss4g.org )
06:38:27 jmckenna: yes those 2 URLs exactly
06:39:09 FrankW: We do not seem to have registered foss4g2010.org yet.
06:39:15 jmckenna: ( i'm answering a raster question on mapserver list...good karma ha )
06:39:22 FrankW: :- )
06:40:12 jmckenna: foss4g2010.org redirects to http://2010.foss4g.org ( when it was live )
06:40:13 sigq: Title: foss4g2010 ( at 2010.foss4g.org )
06:40:33 FrankW: I guess Lorenzo registered it himself?
06:40:39 jmckenna: i guess so
06:40:46 FrankW: It would be much better to keep such domains under direct OSGeo management.
06:40:59 FrankW: Perhaps we should register foss4g2011.org in advance if we want it.
06:41:07 jmckenna: hmm yeah lorenzo owns it
06:41:19 jmckenna: true we should register 2011
06:44:55 FrankW: The changes are applied in DNS and the setup of the site on xblade14.
06:45:03 FrankW: But it is hard to test till the dns changes propagate.
06:45:24 FrankW: I see Lorenzo's site in Italy is live again.
06:45:42 jmckenna: ok thanks. ( his site must have just went back up moments ago )
06:45:51 FrankW: So we should check back in through the day. Dang, I see the time-to-live is set to 24hours instead of our usual 6.
06:46:02 FrankW: I've changed it to six.
06:46:02 jmckenna: but it's hard to attract sponsors with a flaky site
06:46:32 FrankW: It is likely not the end of the world this early, but it could put a few people off.
06:46:39 FrankW: And stable hosting needs to be settled.
06:48:17 jmckenna: true. what is the ip of xblade14 so i can tell when the host is changed?
06:48:37 jmckenna: changed properly, i mean
06:48:37 FrankW: 198.202.74.219
06:48:41 jmckenna: ok thanks
06:50:16 FrankW: It ought to be possible for me to test this by forcing 2010.foss4g.org in my /etc/hosts, but somehow this does not ever work for me with firefox.
06:54:22 stvn: you might need to restart firefox before /etc/hosts changes are noticed
07:34:45 sigq: osgeofeed: Changeset [2767]: propset <http://trac.osgeo.org/osgeo/changeset/2767>
07:35:02 CIA-27: osgeo: tmitchell * r2766 /marketing/website/design/draft2-notext.jpg: propset
07:35:03 CIA-27: osgeo: tmitchell * r2767 /marketing/website/design/ ( 5 files ): propset
08:31:06 spatialguru: @seen _wolf_
08:31:06 sigq: spatialguru: _wolf_ was last seen in #osgeo 3 weeks, 1 day, 18 hours, 31 minutes, and 55 seconds ago: <_wolf_> yeah. I haven't dared to upgrade to .10 yet :S
11:22:04 FrankW: TylerM: are you getting any more emails from Peer1 in the last 4-5 days?
11:22:28 TylerM: frankw: yes, one re: failed backups again
11:22:41 TylerM: are they getting in the way?
11:22:41 FrankW: I'd appreciate your forwarding it to me.
11:22:46 TylerM: will do
11:22:56 FrankW: They seem to have restarted the service despite my having explicitly asked for them to be disabled in a ticket.
11:23:05 TylerM: arg..
11:23:06 FrankW: They did phone me back to tell me how to shut down the service.
11:23:16 FrankW: It's really pissing me off.
11:23:21 TylerM: so another automated process flagged it in their system :P
11:23:40 FrankW: presumably, but you would think they would have a way of keeping track whether it should be enabled.
11:25:39 TylerM: no kidding
11:50:06 jmckenna: FrankW: i notice that the document root ( for 2010.foss4g.org ) points to /osgeo/foss4g/foss4g2010-web/htdocs but should be /osgeo/foss4g/foss4g2010-web mind if i change it?
11:51:13 FrankW: please do.
11:51:21 jmckenna: k
11:51:23 FrankW: I cloned from 2007 which was organized a bit different.
11:51:39 jmckenna: yeah...cool trying
11:54:24 jmckenna: ah ok that seems to work better
13:10:13 sigq: osgeofeed: Ticket #515 ( task created ): allow more downloads <http://trac.osgeo.org/osgeo/ticket/515>
15:40:34 CIA-9: osgeo: simonh * r2768 /foss4g/2009/website/foss4g09_staticmatic/site/schedule/tables/schedule_23_FRI.html: fixed Ben's link
15:40:35 sigq: osgeofeed: Changeset [2768]: fixed Ben's link <http://trac.osgeo.org/osgeo/changeset/2768>
15:56:41 CIA-9: osgeo: simonh * r2769 /foss4g/2009/website/foss4g09_staticmatic/ ( 37 files in 26 dirs ): updated missing links and fixed the sp of over-site.. eek
15:56:42 sigq: osgeofeed: Changeset [2769]: updated missing links and fixed the sp of over-site.. eek <http://trac.osgeo.org/osgeo/changeset/2769>
16:50:26 CIA-9: osgeo: simonh * r2770 /foss4g/2009/website/foss4g09_staticmatic/ ( 37 files in 26 dirs ): added search
16:50:28 sigq: osgeofeed: Changeset [2770]: added search <http://trac.osgeo.org/osgeo/changeset/2770>
20:24:06 TylerM: Marketing Meeting in 1.5 hours
20:27:15 jgarnett: yep
20:36:46 TylerM: Hi Jody.
20:37:02 TylerM: I'll be back later.. if anyone else is around for the meeting, please just say hi so we know to save you a seat : )
20:37:04 TylerM: biab
21:48:42 spatialguru: t-minus 5 : )
21:49:26 TylerM: Hi all - who's around for the marketing committee meeting?
21:49:57 wildintellect: just finishing a mythbusters episode
21:50:30 TylerM: sounds fun.. just finished an episode of Wifes and Daughters up here : )
21:51:58 TylerM: hi CameronShorter
21:52:04 TylerM: how much time do you have?
21:52:28 CameronShorter: about 40 mins
21:52:34 CameronShorter: maybe 35
21:52:54 TylerM: okay, that's great..
21:53:40 TylerM: i wanted to be sure to spend a fair bit of time on website stuff this meeting, perhaps we could front-load next meeting with more focus on the questions you raised in your message earlier
21:53:53 TylerM: though i'm sure we can't avoid it today either : )
21:54:00 CameronShorter: sure
21:54:01 : * TylerM goes to get the agenda
21:54:33 CameronShorter: at bus stop typing slowly with one hand
21:54:36 TylerM: ================
21:54:46 TylerM: Marketing Meeting starting....
21:54:49 TylerM: Agenda: http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Marketing_Meeting_2009.12.10
21:54:51 sigq: Title: Marketing Meeting 2009.12.10 - OSGeo Wiki ( at wiki.osgeo.org )
21:54:58 jgarnett: thanks
21:55:27 TylerM: Andrea Giacomelli should be here too .. I saw he joined and left ( pibinko ) but hopefully returns.
21:55:53 TylerM: CameronShorter: no worries, just holler if we are out-typing you too much : )
21:56:09 TylerM: * ROLL CALL
21:56:17 jgarnett: jgarnett
21:56:20 TylerM: who is around for the meeting, please speak up.. even if just watching
21:56:21 CameronShorter: cameron here
21:56:31 wildintellect: wildintellect - Alex
21:56:32 TylerM: Tyler here
21:56:33 : * wolf_b is here in
21:57:04 TylerM: wolf_b: Hyvää huomenta!! : )
21:57:14 wolf_b: :D
21:57:32 TylerM: Unfortunately Daniele has been on vacation for a while but should be back for next meeting.
21:58:05 TylerM: ** Attending: Jody Garnett, Cameron Shorter, Alex Mandel, Wolf Bergenheim, Tyler Mitchell ( Chair )
21:58:11 TylerM: thanks for coming out guys
21:58:25 TylerM: # Review previous minutes: Marketing Meeting 2009.11.12
21:58:49 TylerM: http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Marketing_Meeting_2009.11.12
21:58:51 sigq: Title: Marketing Meeting 2009.11.12 - OSGeo Wiki ( at wiki.osgeo.org )
21:59:18 CameronShorter: Ok, I on bus, and typing full speed again, but might drop out occasionally.
21:59:39 TylerM: out of us 5 only Alex and I were at last meeting
21:59:52 TylerM: bwoodall and darkblue_B were there too, but must have somethign better to do at 11pm : )
22:00:13 TylerM: ## '''MOTION: Tyler moves to adopt these minutes'''
22:00:49 TylerM: Alex can you second?
22:00:52 CameronShorter: wildintellect, I guess it falls to you to 2nd.
22:01:05 TylerM: : )
22:01:07 wildintellect: sure
22:01:19 TylerM: I see a few items on the list that I didn't make progress on...arg : )
22:01:25 TylerM: all in favour, please say +1
22:01:31 CameronShorter: +1
22:01:32 wildintellect: I was just looking it over too... +1
22:01:40 TylerM: or a non-blocking +0 if you are ambivalent : )
22:01:50 jgarnett: =1
22:02:01 jgarnett: +0
22:02:20 TylerM: good enough, unless Wolf is -1 : )
22:02:30 CameronShorter: Shall I take the next agenda item?
22:02:31 TylerM: Just looking at the summary in those minutes briefly...
22:02:34 wolf_b: +0, but I guess my vote doesn't count ; )
22:02:49 TylerM: Thanks Cameron for providing the stats following the meeting.
22:03:00 TylerM: We will hit some of the Event items and material items later in this meeting.
22:03:27 TylerM: -----------
22:03:29 TylerM: # Add other items to agenda - open for discussion
22:03:32 CameronShorter: Ok, I don't expect to be around at the end. ( Family commitments )
22:03:58 TylerM: okay, so just a matter of ordering the agenda.. what would like bumped up Cameron?
22:04:16 TylerM: foss4g thoughts?
22:04:35 TylerM: or #2 marketing expectations for/from projects?
22:04:48 CameronShorter: Discussing my email, re defining material that OSGeo projects should provide to us.
22:04:53 : * TylerM hears your thumbs screaming in pain
22:05:42 TylerM: Okay, let's add it in for a brief discussion.. since you're running and I think it's a weightier matter than we've got scheduled time for : )
22:05:54 CameronShorter: Frank made good comments that we should be less dictitorial in specifying what is required, and rather say "We want to do promotion this way - if you provide material, then we can promote you".
22:05:57 TylerM: I confess I haven't really chewed on the topic since FOSS4G
22:05:59 CameronShorter: Help us to help you.
22:06:23 TylerM: Frank's comments were good and I think a reasonable representation of other projects' perspective too.
22:06:37 wildintellect: I agree, having a concrete list of things that projects can do to help us market them is a good thing
22:07:02 TylerM: though I also felt a few projects were begging us to help them more by having such a list too.
22:07:31 CameronShorter: To define this fully, I think we need to be clear about what marketing we would like to do, then we can define what is missing in material. We need to be very clear to projects about the value proposition for them.
22:08:05 jgarnett: Your example with the live dvd motivation is good in this respect Cameron.
22:08:10 TylerM: I agree
22:08:10 wildintellect: the classic issue that gets at - do the projects see the value in getting us an up to date flyer every X months
22:09:51 jgarnett: I also feel we can reach past the projects and pull in organisations supporting the projects ( with case studies etc... ). In setting up the geotools site we got a good response of those willing to donate write ups on work and the application of open source.
22:09:51 TylerM: excellent
22:09:52 wildintellect: q? - who's responsibility is it to make it easier for these things to happen
22:10:37 TylerM: heh - as we all look to our workloads : )
22:11:12 jgarnett: wildint - this is somethign to bounce past the projet representative. Best way to get the flyer updated is to show the community what the flyer looks like today. The other one is to bring the flyer into their code base where they can see it....
22:11:12 wildintellect: well is it even all marketing?
22:11:14 CameronShorter: We, the marketing committee are responsible for aggregating what marketers are asking for.
22:11:16 TylerM: I think there will be a job there for someone to take on for an annual term.. similar to how we have handled the main jobs for marketing this past year
22:11:16 CameronShorter: We should start, by setting up a schedule, identifying when we will be using material, and when we need it by.
22:11:17 TylerM: one person could start the discussion, like Cameron did, maybe throw up a suggested structure/focus...
22:11:18 wildintellect: agreed, a timeline for the org would be good
22:11:18 TylerM: then collaborate, modify expectations...
22:11:24 TylerM: then one person has a task list to follow through. reporting monthyl back to committee.
22:11:45 CameronShorter: FOSS4G 2009 was a great motivator for contributions for the LiveDVD, and I think that we could do the same for foss4g 2010, with possibly a minor release mid 2010.
22:11:58 TylerM: I find it infinitely more helpful to know a single person has dug into the issues and has some ideas for a solution : )
22:12:23 CameronShorter: There has been suggestion on the LiveDVD list that we produce our next release in March to reach a few conferences around then.
22:12:46 TylerM: fair enough.. a good time too for the 'left out' projects to perk up and get in for the fall.
22:12:53 TylerM: err.. later in the year : )
22:13:51 wildintellect: my main goal with the next release was to get the rest of the projects onto it
22:14:18 TylerM: So, we can put the points back to the mailing list .. e.g. respond to Cameron's email - then get a wiki page started when thoughts start to gel?
22:14:22 TylerM: fair enough
22:14:25 CameronShorter: Ok, so should we aim for 2 releases, one ~ March, another for foss4g2010?
22:14:37 TylerM: +1
22:14:37 wildintellect: CameronShorter, that was my thought
22:15:04 TylerM: will the live disc mailing list be the main point for discussion?
22:15:21 wildintellect: probably
22:15:27 CameronShorter: To attract contributions, we need to promise projects that their material will be published. Get your material written and we promise to hand it out at XXX conferences.
22:15:42 TylerM: if it's running well that way, then I wouldn't want to change it at all by pushing it into marketing committee realm too much.. e.g. carry on! : )
22:16:29 wildintellect: we'll want marketing to push on the documentation/examples included
22:17:22 CameronShorter: I hadn't considered marketing material being a part of the liveDVD, but it is a good idea. The LiveDVD does have a strong momentum that can be built upon.
22:17:24 jgarnett: I have tried to donate documentation repeatedly and have not been taken up on it.
22:17:28 TylerM: sure - that's an interest that/your group already has too i think
22:17:57 wildintellect: jgarnett, apologies then, we must have missed it
22:18:33 TylerM: Any further/parting thoughts on this before moving on?
22:18:45 TylerM: I'd like to leave this for the live disk team to discuss further
22:18:51 wildintellect: I think some of the points actually lead to the discussion about the web pages
22:18:58 CameronShorter: Tying to the LiveDVD will also help create a drop dead date for contributions. As I expect we will only release the LiveDVD twice a year.
22:18:59 TylerM: and of course Alex and Cameron could report next month on any progress, issues, etc.
22:19:44 CameronShorter: I'd like someone to define a template for the marketing flier that all projects should follow.
22:19:48 TylerM: I was thinking that marketing committee should be able to do at least one or two news items each month... a livedvd invite soon would be a prudent one i think
22:20:09 CameronShorter: It is possibly Arnulf will take this on. Tyler, could you please look for a volunteer?
22:20:13 TylerM: one thought on that CameronShorter ... one sec while i dig up the link
22:20:43 TylerM: we do have some new templates worth considering using.. roughly shown at http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Marketing_Material_Samples
22:20:45 sigq: Title: Marketing Material Samples - OSGeo Wiki ( at wiki.osgeo.org )
22:20:52 TylerM: too big for your screen i assume though ; )
22:21:20 jgarnett: Tyler do we have the flyer template in open office or word yet?
22:21:22 TylerM: The marketing material issues have been on my plate this year, but certainly we can look to the Germans who have been most active in updating them.
22:21:32 jgarnett: I don't mind doing the conversion again if you can get me an origional.
22:21:52 jgarnett: I think the motivation of "new template" will be enough for this year.
22:22:08 TylerM: jgarnett: the previous version we always in scribus i think.. but current I'm not sure about
22:22:18 TylerM: i'm in the process of getting our final delvierables into svn
22:22:38 TylerM: TODO: Tyler to point Jody to flyer template for conversion into open formats
22:22:41 CameronShorter: I'm happy to promote the value of filling in a flier and chase projects, if someone else can provide the template, and mentor people through creating their fliers.
22:23:03 TylerM: ok sounds good
22:23:29 TylerM: all right, anything else before we move on?
22:23:30 jgarnett: I can provide an updated geotools flyer as a reference point - and to test the template.
22:23:36 TylerM: great
22:23:54 CameronShorter: I'm done, next point?
22:24:11 TylerM: ---------------
22:24:16 TylerM: # Website concepts...
22:24:31 TylerM: an infinite amount to discuss here, I'm afraid : )
22:24:40 TylerM: first, some background...
22:24:46 wildintellect: well lets break it down into small pieces
22:24:54 TylerM: tried to summarise it here into two pieces: http://lists.osgeo.org/pipermail/marketing/2009-December/002343.html
22:24:56 sigq: Title: [Marketing] Website branding and site focus ideas ( at lists.osgeo.org )
22:25:04 : * wildintellect notes that he'd like to talk about wiki issues somewhere later in the discussion
22:25:14 TylerM: ( please save it in the agenda )
22:25:18 TylerM: ## Branding ...
22:25:34 TylerM: with some of our snazzy new graphics, brochures, etc. the hope was to also
22:25:51 TylerM: bring in some ideas for how to also spice up the website.
22:26:09 wolf_b: it sure needs spicing :D
22:26:21 TylerM: so I got the designers to give me some ideas... *we'll get to the content side of the question in a moment )
22:26:41 TylerM: wolf_b: and that means a lot coming from you who helped make its current incarnation : )
22:26:44 TylerM: thanks for coming to speak up on it
22:26:46 TylerM: : )
22:27:01 wolf_b: sure
22:27:07 TylerM: some designs are here: http://svn.osgeo.org/osgeo/marketing/website/design/
22:27:08 sigq: Title: osgeo - Revision 2770: /marketing/website/design ( at svn.osgeo.org )
22:27:32 TylerM: draft2a.jpg is my cropped version of draft1a.jpg- the footer of which I thought was too overpowering.
22:27:48 TylerM: there are a bunch of other critiques i have, but in general I feel it's workable.
22:28:06 TylerM: * the header is fine.. the blocks/boxes graphics are nice, colours good..
22:28:15 wildintellect: I think overall it's heading the right direction - making it easier for new users to find what they're looking for
22:28:41 : * wolf_b agrees
22:28:41 TylerM: * intro text is too long and distracting, their footer idea too cumbersome and a secondary template is also required...
22:29:04 jgarnett: you already have my feedback along similar lines
22:29:05 TylerM: e.g. this one is a portal launching point, the secondary is the 'normal' page with more info on it.
22:29:26 jgarnett: the other thing to consider is secondary websites; for example project website; or local chapter websites.
22:29:33 wolf_b: TylerM: I think the intro text is not too long nor very distracting
22:29:36 TylerM: right thx jody.. just for the record i pinged a couple of you and a couple others earlier on this topic and got very positive feedback.
22:30:14 wolf_b: jgarnett: yes, they should ideally have the same style, perhaps some changed graphics
22:30:57 jgarnett: so what are you wanting for feedback at the moment? I feel I am stuck until we get a normal page, and a secondary project/chapter website on the table.
22:31:12 TylerM: I often wonder too how much help some local chapters could use.. e.g. this year 1 or 2 local chapters decided to start using the website for their own pages... instead of only wiki
22:31:24 TylerM: So what I would like...
22:31:25 jgarnett: ( ie we need to carve out some space for the secondary website's logo; or even the title of a normal page, while not having the contact links jump around )
22:32:04 wolf_b: we also need a template for normal pages...
22:32:07 TylerM: 1 - general agreement that the style works for us
22:32:09 wolf_b: this is only the front page
22:32:19 wolf_b: +1
22:32:23 TylerM: 2 - the secondary/normal page template, which I'll get in a few days I think
22:33:18 TylerM: And having discussed with Wolf earlier, it doesn't seem unreasonably hard to port these changes into the drupal framework...
22:33:32 jgarnett: +0 ( waiting for the complete story )
22:33:38 TylerM: so that covers: 3 - ability to incorporate the designs into a draft website
22:34:03 TylerM: that's it.. no need vote : ) just speak up if you disagree on anything or have further thoughts.
22:34:25 TylerM: I think we're probably all on same page and would like to see how we can change/improve
22:34:42 jgarnett: thanks for including sample screen snap on a small laptop
22:34:48 TylerM: So I take the task of coordinating the templates and collecting further feedback.
22:35:20 TylerM: wolf_b: can we work together to get it into a test drupal theme?
22:35:39 TylerM: jgarnett: I was concerned it was too wide but worked out great actually.
22:35:54 jgarnett: did you want to talk about the site map?
22:36:01 TylerM: yeah, next..
22:36:01 wolf_b: TylerM: sure!
22:36:10 TylerM: wolf_b: how can I help? : )
22:36:33 TylerM: chopping up the graphics? I'm sure i can't help write css : )
22:36:39 TylerM: or hack drupal template hehe
22:36:41 wolf_b: humm, can you get me a shell account to the community.osgeo.org machine?
22:36:59 TylerM: yup
22:37:02 wolf_b: I have the css and drupal covered
22:37:19 wildintellect: wolf_b, macho over in qgis has offered to help with that too
22:37:20 wolf_b: if you feel like chopping up, go for it : )=
22:37:25 TylerM: ## '''TODO: Tyler to get Wolf shell account to community.osgeo.org test site.'''
22:37:49 TylerM: okay thanks wil try
22:37:56 TylerM: okay to move on folks?
22:38:05 wolf_b: fine by me
22:38:17 wolf_b: I'll get working on the new template slowly
22:38:24 TylerM: did we lose CameronShorter ?
22:38:32 CameronShorter: hi
22:38:51 TylerM: did you get a chance to look at any of this earlier?
22:39:40 TylerM: Just for the record, Wolf and I are both on WebCom too - so we can shuttle back and forth as needed. But in the short term we'll get a demo up for discussion purposes.
22:39:48 TylerM: Okay, let's move on to next aspect to website stuff
22:39:56 TylerM: ## Site organisation and content
22:40:05 TylerM: This is a bit more complex...
22:40:31 TylerM: I've done up a site map diagram based on a ton of input from the 'site focus' wiki page...
22:40:50 TylerM: http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/WebCom_OSGeo_Site_Focus
22:40:52 sigq: Title: WebCom OSGeo Site Focus - OSGeo Wiki ( at wiki.osgeo.org )
22:41:13 TylerM: the diagram is here: http://svn.osgeo.org/osgeo/marketing/website/sitemap/
22:41:14 sigq: Title: osgeo - Revision 2770: /marketing/website/sitemap ( at svn.osgeo.org )
22:41:19 TylerM: hope your browser likes svg .. sorry
22:41:58 jgarnett: if not inkscape is good ( and you can zoom in and read the diagram )
22:42:00 TylerM: I also put in a rough outline of our current site.. and made sure each page was somehow represented in the new ideas ( right side ) in the diagram
22:42:26 TylerM: In the end, there really doesn't seem that we need very many new pages
22:42:37 TylerM: mainly ones that aggregate info for particular use cases.
22:42:47 wildintellect: the black are new pages?
22:43:15 TylerM: yes, and I'll assume we will want to refactor some of the others as well, but the black to begin with
22:43:28 jgarnett: I almost find the words in brackets more clear ...
22:44:02 TylerM: yeah, I added them for clarity. ... the titles used in the blocks were completely arbitrary but do track our brochures.
22:44:24 TylerM: So the exercise from here out is to make sure that all your use cases are covered by such a layout.
22:44:43 jgarnett: for things like common pages; some of those are only common to us ( the members of the foundation ). Example is committees. I would rather "pull" up public facing committtees like Education and Journal, and push down the internal running of the foundation.
22:44:58 wolf_b: I like the fact that we would have distinct sections
22:45:18 wolf_b: it helps the visitor to build his own mind-map of the site
22:45:27 TylerM: Please try to approach the sitemap with a view of making sure that User X or Developer Y that you know. ... and how he would approach it.
22:45:36 jgarnett: actually education may wish to have a seperate page for their committee; and a different one for education professionals visiting the site.
22:45:40 TylerM: what they'd need etc.. and fill in or write me with your comments.
22:45:53 TylerM: Education was a tricky one, imo
22:46:01 jgarnett: yep
22:46:01 wolf_b: this kind of two-level hierarch helps also the visitor to keep to the part that interests her
22:46:27 wildintellect: well we should refine and expand the user cases on the Site Focus page and walk through the mental map with each
22:46:31 jgarnett: could we ask a member of the education committee to review the site map ...
22:46:36 TylerM: i ended up putting education in as users, more or less, in my mind at least
22:47:12 TylerM: jgarnett: not a bad idea..
22:47:15 jgarnett: one question - I like seeing some sign of life on an initial home page ... a feed of news stories or something.
22:47:23 jgarnett: there is not a space for such a thing in the proposal...
22:47:47 TylerM: wildintellect: right, I think if we can each go through it and make sure the top 5+ points for each section are covered, it'd be a good exercise.
22:48:00 wildintellect: I agree and disagree about sign of life
22:48:07 TylerM: jgarnett: I'm conflicted about that too...
22:48:15 jgarnett: as am I
22:48:16 TylerM: wanting a 'commnunity' page that has more of that stuff...
22:48:28 TylerM: versus having it be part of the first thing people see
22:48:51 TylerM: but that is also somewhat of where i'd see 'connect' leading people to
22:48:55 jgarnett: ( just reviewing eclipse / apache etc... now
22:49:02 wildintellect: for me, when I go to a new FOSS project the 1st thing I look for is last release date
22:49:06 TylerM: a small feed could fit into a block possibly
22:49:52 wildintellect: but it drives me nuts when the homepage is news, and I don't even know what the project does
22:50:30 wildintellect: I think that's the reaction I had 1st time I visited OSGeo - "What is this?"
22:50:33 TylerM: i hear ya.. it's a good use case to capture too
22:50:59 jgarnett: wildint I wonder if a low trafic feed; like "events" would cut it ...
22:51:15 wildintellect: either that or latest project releases
22:51:36 wildintellect: events is kinda tricky
22:51:40 jgarnett: this is a case where everyone is correct; and we should roll play the result on the site map ( see if any of our prospective visitors think like wildintellect )
22:51:47 jgarnett: and see what the result looks like visually
22:52:09 wildintellect: since sometimes it's just events that people in OSGeo are interested in, not OSGeo officially attending
22:52:11 jgarnett: wildintellet I also check for any date on the home page to see of an organsiation is active.
22:52:36 jgarnett: the trick is to make whatever feed matter to our target audience.
22:52:40 TylerM: interesting perspectives
22:53:10 wildintellect: are we in agreement on who the target audience for the 1st page is?
22:53:19 TylerM: since in this design idea we have compartments for the 3 'main' user groups .. plus community and advocacy.. everything should fit *somewhere* I'm hoping
22:53:30 TylerM: *audiences*
22:53:34 jgarnett: I had 3 people interested in the 1st page; I assume that was why we had clear jumping off points.
22:53:40 jgarnett: one for each target audience....
22:53:51 TylerM: "users", "developers", "integrators/govt/education"
22:54:15 TylerM: plus "community/connect" and "advocacy/members" .. more or less.
22:54:37 jgarnett: gis professional with esri background looking to switch
22:54:37 jgarnett: government
22:54:37 jgarnett: education
22:54:43 jgarnett: developers use google, not the front page
22:54:54 wildintellect: well so it may not be possible to pick feed that works for all of those
22:55:08 wildintellect: maybe the 2nd tier pages would have feeds oriented towards each audience
22:55:17 TylerM: i would expect that
22:55:19 jgarnett: what helps is that only some of those people will come through the front door...
22:55:52 TylerM: right
22:56:18 jgarnett: okay - the plan is still clear. Review the site map with an eye towards each target audience. And then compare notes?
22:56:25 TylerM: So i suggest we take this offline and individually review the site map with 1 or 2 use cases in mind.
22:56:32 TylerM: right-o
22:56:43 TylerM: to the mailing list.
22:57:28 TylerM: then discuss further and, ideally, edit the map if you can
22:57:42 TylerM: using freemind software
22:58:25 TylerM: ### '''TODO: Each member review the sitemap and provide feedback from perspective of potential use case from site focus page.'''
22:58:41 TylerM: Anything else on website stuff?
22:59:14 TylerM: Thanks for the discussion, feels we are on the same page more or less
22:59:36 TylerM: and want the same biggest bang for the buck from a marketing perspective.
22:59:51 TylerM: I'm also hoping to take a crack at creating some of those 'missing' pages.
23:00:11 TylerM: If anyone else wants to take one on, feel free. I certainly prefer prototypes over nothing : )
23:00:24 TylerM: If that's all on website, we can switch to the next item..
23:00:31 jgarnett: thanks
23:00:36 TylerM: ---------
23:00:47 TylerM: # Events: AGU 2009 http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/AGU_2009
23:00:49 sigq: Title: AGU 2009 - OSGeo Wiki ( at wiki.osgeo.org )
23:01:06 TylerM: not much to discuss here I think.. booths were no longer available, as few of us are speaking
23:01:33 wildintellect: the only question here is, how can we implement better long term planning around event coordination?
23:01:42 TylerM: I'll be meeting with Landon and Alex and Brian while in the area.
23:01:57 TylerM: wildintellect: good question
23:02:20 wildintellect: I think the wiki is inefficient at tracking calendars
23:02:33 TylerM: I was hoping we'd have a list of our top 3-5 events for the year lined up 6+ months in advance. Seems we really _have_ to for getting booths, etc. lined up properly.
23:03:07 TylerM: related challenge is that unless someone comes to us and asks to support them at an event, it's up to us to find the best value for our dollar
23:03:07 wildintellect: should we ponder a shared calendar of some kind, or wiki macro
23:03:37 TylerM: you mean some sort of wiki form? the shared marketing calender might be enough?
23:03:40 wildintellect: something that allows us to put the deadlines for prep in one color, and the actual events in another
23:04:05 wildintellect: shared ical/webdav etc is fine with me
23:04:16 wildintellect: since that's how we want people to view it anyways
23:04:36 TylerM: I think we've done good having the upcoming events on the agenda for the meetings, but with a quiet spring/summer it was easier to miss a few things
23:04:58 TylerM: Sure, any event will logically be date stamped, so feel free to use it.
23:05:00 TylerM: Oh...
23:05:09 TylerM: wondering if you guys are able to even edit the calendar!
23:05:19 wildintellect: I don't think we can
23:05:55 TylerM: ## '''TODO: Tyler to look at options for hosting a shareable group calendar - either opening up the current webdav-based one or using drupal'''
23:06:23 TylerM: I forget how the user/pass is set up on the webdav at present, but could just share a group password - likely easiest.
23:06:48 wildintellect: it would be great if it could just be managed by the LDAP or something like that
23:06:49 TylerM: but we could also store them in drupal too.. hmm
23:07:14 TylerM: yeah.. let me look into it and see what options we have
23:07:21 wildintellect: as long as a calendar subscription and web view is available those are my only requirement
23:07:22 TylerM: not too many on the ldap side i'll bet
23:07:40 TylerM: k
23:07:49 TylerM: ------
23:07:54 TylerM: Events: AAG 2010
23:08:05 TylerM: I'm tentatively booked a booth for it.
23:08:24 TylerM: they are pressing for payment. It sounds like many OSGeo folks will be there and able to man the booth.
23:08:37 wildintellect: Eric Wolf agreed to be in charge on site
23:08:47 TylerM: And based on good feedback from last year, I think it's an easy win for us.
23:09:00 wildintellect: and Andrew Turner is backup + will work to find local funding
23:09:12 TylerM: excellent
23:09:50 wildintellect: budget is about the same as last year $1250 I think
23:10:07 TylerM: it sometimes feels like it's spending a lot.. but when you look at how much else it leverages ( e.g. 10 people who travelled there and volunteered time ) it starts to make more sense
23:10:12 TylerM: yup, okay
23:10:37 wildintellect: well, this one is in D.C. so we better make a good showing
23:10:45 TylerM: ## '''MOTION: Tyler moves that we support a booth and local presence at AAG 2010, with OSGeo members manning the booth.'''
23:11:10 wildintellect: anyone else still here?
23:11:11 TylerM: any further discussion on it?
23:11:26 TylerM: hehe - I don't think so : )
23:11:28 jgarnett: +0
23:11:49 TylerM: thanks
23:12:10 TylerM: no worries.. let's move on
23:12:15 TylerM: ---------
23:12:46 TylerM: ## Events: FOSS4G 2009 - and parting comments on this. We covered some last month, just left this recurring in case Cameron had more thoughts.
23:12:51 TylerM: but anyone else ?
23:13:25 TylerM: we also talked about 2010 ideas too and I was to follow up and try to get a Barcelona rep to commit to work with Marketing Committee for the event ahead of time.
23:13:29 TylerM: ---------
23:13:38 TylerM: ## Events: FOSS4G 2010...
23:13:48 TylerM: who added Adwords comment in agenda?
23:14:08 TylerM: ahh Lorenzo di
23:14:09 TylerM: did
23:14:34 TylerM: I have some google vouchers sitting around for free adwords.. will coordinate with him to use them for FOSS4G 2010.
23:14:54 TylerM: '''TODO: coordinate adwords with Lorenzo for FOSS4G 2010'''
23:15:01 TylerM: I bet the rest of you are fading like me ; )
23:15:07 wildintellect: looks like we still need a link on foss4g.org to 2010
23:15:39 TylerM: uh yeah, good point, something else lorenzo and I were talking about.
23:15:40 wildintellect: does http://foss4g.org need some sprucing up
23:15:40 TylerM: thanks!
23:15:41 sigq: Title: OSGeo Events ( at foss4g.org )
23:16:08 TylerM: yes, we need to change it to it's own page instead of using the conference mangement system..
23:16:16 wildintellect: ah
23:16:33 TylerM: '''TODO: Tyler to follow up with Lorenzo, Jeff re: foss4g.org'''
23:16:38 TylerM: -------
23:16:46 TylerM: # Marketing Materials....
23:16:55 TylerM: as noted last month, we're pretty much wrapped up on this front
23:16:57 wildintellect: I think we should probably also clear up how conference info will be archived and retrieved
23:17:17 TylerM: wildintellect: Jeff takes care of it in a systematic way..
23:17:25 TylerM: or were you talking website?
23:17:29 TylerM: websites
23:17:34 wildintellect: web accessible
23:17:52 wildintellect: past conference proceedings are great things as PR
23:18:14 TylerM: gotcha
23:18:37 TylerM: I'm in the middle porting our marketing material over to the website in a meaninful way...
23:18:45 TylerM: starting a sort of index at: http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Marketing_Material_Samples
23:18:47 sigq: Title: Marketing Material Samples - OSGeo Wiki ( at wiki.osgeo.org )
23:19:02 TylerM: with links from each item to a wiki page..
23:19:14 TylerM: it's 2009 and I finally got to learn to use image maps ;- )
23:19:35 wildintellect: that's old school
23:20:00 TylerM: it all comes around eventually ;- )
23:20:11 TylerM: though I guess I should have used javascript somehow ;- )
23:20:11 jgarnett: Tyler I am still looking for more out of these materials;
23:20:15 wildintellect: I guess the next step is to start working on getting materials out to places
23:20:21 jgarnett: font selection, color, logo useage etc...
23:20:48 wildintellect: jgarnett, you mean you want a standards doc
23:20:51 TylerM: my priority here is getting the 'current' deliverables 1 ) publicly accessible, 2 ) in usable formats, 3 ) with some guidance on how to update
23:21:09 TylerM: not past #1 yet.. but obviously some help with #2 would be useful : )
23:21:14 jgarnett: fair enough; and I will help get it into usable formats - but right now I am making stuff up
23:21:31 jgarnett: but yes lets continue.
23:21:33 TylerM: I can barely spend a CPU cycle on anything new ; )
23:22:08 TylerM: once I'm done this task then I'm going to get a web-based template up and running for us to easily customise new versions of the docs.
23:22:30 wildintellect: that seems to feed into the templates for projects
23:22:30 TylerM: but I'm also sure there will be critique and feedback all through #1-3 : )
23:22:38 TylerM: wildintellect: right...
23:23:09 jgarnett: fair enough ( your color for your colormap picture is not coming through and matching the other materials - this is why I bring it up )
23:23:16 TylerM: call me idealistic, but I don't want to have to be emailing text snippits around and then having 'editors' save them into SVN somewhere and paste them into openoffice..etc
23:24:07 TylerM: jgarnett: colormap picture? sorry i don't follow
23:24:21 jgarnett: http://wiki.osgeo.org/images/6/69/Market_2009.jpg
23:24:53 TylerM: sry, i don't see anythign wrong there
23:25:12 wildintellect: the on screen color is not the same as the printed color
23:25:25 TylerM: but of course : )
23:25:30 jgarnett: understood; it is not matching the other pictures on that page ...
23:25:36 TylerM: ah, ok
23:25:36 jgarnett: hense my confusion.
23:25:44 jgarnett: nor the color swatches
23:25:47 TylerM: yeah i'll turf the rest of that page eventually
23:25:50 TylerM: old stuff really
23:26:07 TylerM: try this... open that jpg in safari, IE and firefox..
23:26:15 TylerM: and enjoy the differences in rendering colours too :P
23:26:20 jgarnett: opened it in a couple paint programs just now
23:26:26 wildintellect: yes that green looks wrong, until icc color profiles are applied
23:26:28 jgarnett: it is just a different color
23:26:44 wildintellect: which ones are different?
23:26:55 jgarnett: that could be it
23:27:11 TylerM: looks better in safari than ff
23:27:12 TylerM: for me
23:27:14 TylerM: : )
23:27:35 wildintellect: probably because the Icc wasn't embedded
23:27:43 wildintellect: firefox 3.5 uses icc now
23:27:57 TylerM: oh i'll upgrade now i'm curious ;- )
23:28:06 TylerM: nothing much more on materials side
23:28:18 TylerM: unless any other want to be involved in the work to get it up to par
23:28:20 TylerM: and more accessible.
23:28:33 TylerM: otherwise, I'll update next month again.
23:28:36 TylerM: -----
23:28:46 TylerM: # Exhibition Pack
23:28:50 TylerM: anything to add here Alex?
23:29:29 wildintellect: don't think so
23:29:34 wildintellect: we haven't done anything new
23:30:01 wildintellect: not really sure if other chapters have expressed interest in the same setup
23:30:28 TylerM: not recently.. but when events pop up i'm sure they will
23:30:32 TylerM: -----
23:30:36 TylerM: # Any other items to discuss?
23:31:02 wildintellect: wrangling the wiki sprawl as an image issue?
23:31:29 TylerM: hmm
23:31:49 TylerM: is it bad p.r. to be using a wiki as such a major part of our face? : )
23:32:00 wildintellect: yes and no
23:32:02 jgarnett: depends who your target audience is
23:32:07 wildintellect: it's good because it shows community
23:32:13 jgarnett: gains cred for being open; loses cred for being offical
23:32:18 wildintellect: it's bad because people are getting lost and not finding stuff
23:32:38 TylerM: i'm always using the search :/
23:32:47 TylerM: you'd think i'd learn about bookmarks by now
23:32:55 wildintellect: well that only sometimes works
23:32:55 jgarnett: took me forever to search for the maketting agenda
23:33:04 jgarnett: and you had posted it in IRC before I found it
23:33:28 wildintellect: it's the biggest downside to a wiki - without some sort of standards - it sprawls out of control
23:33:54 TylerM: I do a fair bit of refactoring for the committees I'm on..
23:33:56 wildintellect: you'll remember I noted we have more than 500 orphaned pages
23:34:03 TylerM: wowza
23:34:23 TylerM: jgarnett: next time http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Marketing - I always link to meetings there
23:34:25 sigq: Title: Marketing Committee - OSGeo Wiki ( at wiki.osgeo.org )
23:34:31 TylerM: Marketing_Meetings : )
23:34:42 TylerM: speaking of which...
23:34:47 TylerM: next meeting schedule...
23:35:11 wildintellect: well this one seemed to get people, so month from now?
23:35:13 TylerM: January 13/14th
23:35:36 TylerM: does the web calendar feed show it right for you guys?
23:35:44 wildintellect: usually
23:35:53 TylerM: http://osgeo.org/calendars/Marketing.ics - i think
23:35:58 wildintellect: yes it's correct
23:36:03 wildintellect: in thunderbird
23:36:04 TylerM: okay, cause we switched from 1st week to 2nd
23:36:11 TylerM: and one of my apps had a fit
23:36:16 TylerM: great
23:36:33 TylerM: some apps do edit webcal very well it seems
23:36:57 TylerM: Well, made it through another meeting, with no shortage of more things to talk about : )
23:37:03 TylerM: Thanks very much for making the time guys!
23:37:15 TylerM: corner me online any time
23:37:49 wildint: TylerM, https://developer.mozilla.org/En/ICC_color_correction_in_Firefox
23:37:50 sigq: Title: ICC color correction in Firefox - MDC ( at developer.mozilla.org )
23:37:51 TylerM: I call the meeting to a close after 1h43 minutes
23:38:00 TylerM: Have a great day/night/week : )
23:38:09 TylerM: thx
23:38:38 wolf_b: you too
23:38:47 TylerM: cya wolf
23:43:37 jgarnett: ciao
23:43:38 sigq: osgeofeed: Changeset [2772]: added freemind png file and updated mime type properties <http://trac.osgeo.org/osgeo/changeset/2772>
23:44:00 CIA-9: osgeo: jsanz * r2771 /community/presentations/20091204-gvsig-valencia/osgeo-es.odp: added freemind png file and updated mime type properties
23:44:00 CIA-9: osgeo: jsanz * r2772 /community/presentations/20091204-gvsig-valencia/ ( reunion.png reunion.mm osgeo-es.pdf ): added freemind png file and updated mime type properties