| 00:38:24 | sigq: | osgeofeed: Changeset [3052]: Added SpatiaLite? <http://trac.osgeo.org/osgeo/changeset/3052> |
| 01:12:24 | CIA-84: | osgeo: pka * r3052 /livedvd/gisvm/trunk/ ( bin/main.sh bin/install_spatialite.sh contributors.csv ): Added SpatiaLite |
| 01:30:45 | sigq: | osgeofeed: Changeset [3053]: Added comments properly <http://trac.osgeo.org/osgeo/changeset/3053> |
| 01:55:31 | jachym: | please, anybody knows about running OGC WCS ( can be demo ) server? |
| 02:08:43 | CIA-84: | osgeo: jldominguez * r3053 /livedvd/gisvm/trunk/bin/beta_software/ugvsigmo.desktop: Added comments properly |
| 04:10:22 | CIA-84: | osgeo: pka * r3054 /livedvd/gisvm/trunk/bin/install_spatialite.sh: |
| 04:10:22 | CIA-84: | osgeo: * Sample data added |
| 04:10:22 | CIA-84: | osgeo: * Installation in /usr/local |
| 04:10:27 | sigq: | osgeofeed: Changeset [3054]: * Sample data added * Installation in /usr/local <http://trac.osgeo.org/osgeo/changeset/3054> |
| 05:12:39 | TylerM: | jachym: I've run WCS server with mapserver before |
| 05:12:55 | crschmidt: | oh |
| 05:12:55 | jachym: | coool |
| 05:12:57 | crschmidt: | when is our phone call? |
| 05:13:03 | crschmidt: | 2 hours? |
| 05:13:10 | crschmidt: | and should i set up MC's phone number for it again? |
| 05:13:19 | jachym: | TylerM: I'm setuping some pywps unittests, having this would be helpful |
| 05:14:23 | TylerM: | i guess someone on #mapserver might have a demo for you |
| 05:14:57 | TylerM: | crschmidt: 45 minutes.. |
| 05:15:11 | TylerM: | but i'm guessing some will show up an hour late :[ |
| 05:15:23 | TylerM: | having the voice line might be helpful if possible |
| 05:15:43 | crschmidt: | k |
| 05:15:58 | jachym: | TylerM: it is not a problem to get it running, but to get some server, which will live for longer then two months |
| 05:16:04 | jachym: | thanks anyway |
| 05:16:31 | TylerM: | jachym: ah, okay.. I suggest asking there |
| 05:18:00 | crschmidt: | jachym: You could set up your own. |
| 05:18:32 | TylerM: | yeah, it's not too hard.. if you can set up a mapserver site there isn't much more to it |
| 05:18:42 | jachym: | crschmidt: ofcourse, but before doing this, I would rather use some known, reference one |
| 05:19:21 | jachym: | something like openlayers wms server ( but for wcs ) |
| 05:19:26 | jachym: | or nasa jpl |
| 05:19:29 | crschmidt: | There is no OpenLayers WMS server |
| 05:19:31 | crschmidt: | afaik |
| 05:19:50 | jachym: | it is metacarta, afaik |
| 05:20:27 | jachym: | but if I just need some demo map, FAST, I take it |
| 05:34:02 | CIA-84: | osgeo: jldominguez * r3055 /livedvd/gisvm/trunk/bin/main.sh: Added call to install_beta_and_submenu.sh. It should create a new submenu with a reddish icon and 'Unofficial gvSIG Mobile for Linux' in it. |
| 05:41:40 | TylerM: | hi markusN |
| 05:42:58 | markusN: | hi TylerM |
| 05:48:53 | TylerM: | Board meeting in 10 minutes |
| 05:49:33 | TylerM: | meeting in IRC, voice optional later |
| 05:49:40 | TylerM: | crschmidt: I got your email with just a time in it - no dial in info. |
| 05:50:31 | crschmidt: | TylerM: It's there in another mime-type, but I'll re-send it. |
| 05:50:37 | crschmidt: | in another mime object, that is |
| 05:50:53 | TylerM: | ahhh ok |
| 05:53:14 | TylerM: | ping seven |
| 05:53:20 | : | * hobu here |
| 05:53:29 | TylerM: | great thx |
| 05:53:49 | : | * crschmidt is here |
| 05:54:21 | crschmidt: | TylerM: you saw the email seven just sent? |
| 05:54:31 | FrankW: | I'm here, and have 30 minutes |
| 05:54:35 | : | * seven grumbles a bit but is here. |
| 05:54:56 | TylerM: | ah good seven : ) |
| 05:55:08 | TylerM: | we can just use IRC ? |
| 05:55:12 | crschmidt: | benefit of setting up phone meeting: work jabberbot messages me with 5 minutes notice |
| 05:55:18 | crschmidt: | hello sleepy mckenna |
| 05:56:05 | TylerM: | Agenda: http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Board_Meeting_2010-02-04 |
| 05:56:08 | sigq: | Title: Board Meeting 2010-02-04 - OSGeo Wiki ( at wiki.osgeo.org ) |
| 05:56:16 | jmckenna: | ha hi crschmidt - you know this feeling |
| 05:56:29 | crschmidt: | yep |
| 05:56:38 | TylerM: | So far I see: Frank, Howard, Jeff, Chris, Arnulf, Markus |
| 05:56:48 | TylerM: | congrats on having quorum : ) |
| 05:57:06 | TylerM: | for a few minutes anyway |
| 05:57:28 | TylerM: | sounded like Ravi was going to make it |
| 05:58:36 | TylerM: | no word from Ari? |
| 05:58:55 | FrankW: | I'm on the conference call waiting for the leader. |
| 05:59:32 | : | * seven has her Skype up again. Are we to go on the call right away? |
| 05:59:44 | crschmidt: | I thought we were starting here. I'll start he call up. |
| 06:00:00 | jmckenna: | i wasn't sure of plan. |
| 06:00:11 | TylerM: | seven: your call : ) |
| 06:00:32 | : | * crschmidt is on the phone with frank |
| 06:00:33 | : | * markusN in standby - what should he do? |
| 06:00:42 | TylerM: | just looking at agenda.. what needs voting? |
| 06:00:47 | : | * jmckenna grabs headset |
| 06:00:49 | TylerM: | degree graduation... |
| 06:00:57 | TylerM: | no foss4g budget i guess |
| 06:01:13 | TylerM: | rest is mostly just info or not urgent. |
| 06:01:23 | crschmidt: | http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Proposed_Board_Election_Procedure ? |
| 06:01:24 | sigq: | Title: Proposed Board Election Procedure - OSGeo Wiki ( at wiki.osgeo.org ) |
| 06:01:40 | crschmidt: | perhaps that isn't in a position for a vote. |
| 06:01:51 | jmckenna: | haven't seen final budget either. LOC seems deep into planning with closed doors. |
| 06:01:55 | : | * seven is on the call now. |
| 06:02:00 | seven: | Shall we start? |
| 06:02:07 | jmckenna: | rrr in other language i can't read, ha |
| 06:02:22 | TylerM: | voice or IRC? |
| 06:02:29 | seven: | TylerM: want to make your start >>> thingy? |
| 06:02:39 | TylerM: | ================= BOARD MEETING =============== : ) |
| 06:02:40 | seven: | Here. |
| 06:02:43 | seven: | He. |
| 06:02:45 | TylerM: | I'll do minutes. |
| 06:02:48 | seven: | Arnulf is here. |
| 06:02:51 | seven: | Thanks. |
| 06:02:53 | TylerM: | Roll call please |
| 06:03:01 | : | * FrankW is here and on phone. |
| 06:03:02 | markusN: | are you on the call or no?? |
| 06:03:16 | : | * hobu is here and on phone |
| 06:03:22 | seven: | We are also on the phone. |
| 06:03:30 | jmckenna: | is here. will join phone |
| 06:03:32 | : | * TylerM better dial up then :S |
| 06:03:45 | seven: | Maybe we can just use IRC and stay silent on the phone. :- ) |
| 06:04:10 | : | * markusN dyalling up |
| 06:04:16 | TylerM: | I suggest we just dial in at the end if/when needed |
| 06:04:32 | TylerM: | I'm not a good scribe listening in two places ; ) |
| 06:04:35 | seven: | OK. I'll stay on anyway. |
| 06:04:42 | : | * markusN is here and on phone |
| 06:04:51 | seven: | Approve minutes for Board Meeting 2010-01-07 |
| 06:05:03 | : | * crschmidt +1 |
| 06:05:07 | TylerM: | * Attending: Arnulf, Frank, Jeff, Markus, Howard, Chris |
| 06:05:17 | : | * seven admits that she has not done all that she was supposed to. |
| 06:05:18 | TylerM: | * Previous minutes: http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Board_Meeting_2010-01-07 |
| 06:05:20 | sigq: | Title: Board Meeting 2010-01-07 - OSGeo Wiki ( at wiki.osgeo.org ) |
| 06:05:23 | seven: | +1 |
| 06:05:59 | TylerM: | ** '''MOTION:''' Adopt previous meeting minutes. Chris moved, Arnulf seconded.... |
| 06:06:03 | hobu: | +1 |
| 06:06:29 | markusN: | +1 |
| 06:06:34 | FrankW: | +1 |
| 06:06:41 | seven: | Motion: Graduate deegree ( Deegree Incubation Status ) |
| 06:06:52 | seven: | Somone needs to second this. |
| 06:06:53 | TylerM: | jmckenna vote? |
| 06:06:57 | : | * FrankW seconds. |
| 06:07:02 | seven: | +#1 |
| 06:07:03 | FrankW: | +1 |
| 06:07:06 | crschmidt: | +1 |
| 06:07:07 | hobu: | +1 |
| 06:07:11 | jmckenna: | +1 |
| 06:07:13 | markusN: | +1 |
| 06:07:17 | seven: | Hooray, we did it. |
| 06:07:19 | seven: | :- ) |
| 06:07:20 | jmays1: | yay |
| 06:07:30 | seven: | jmays1: Congrats! |
| 06:07:35 | seven: | FOSS4G Budget status |
| 06:07:35 | jmays1: | : ) |
| 06:07:38 | TylerM: | * '''MOTION:''' Graduate degree. Arnulf moved, Frank seconded, all were in favour! Congrats jmays1 : ) |
| 06:07:44 | seven: | No news from Lorenzo. |
| 06:07:51 | TylerM: | right |
| 06:07:57 | jmckenna: | right |
| 06:07:58 | TylerM: | must not be too urgent this time : ) |
| 06:08:04 | seven: | Seems like they wanted to get more information and then decided that it is good as it is but never forwarded it to us. |
| 06:08:08 | seven: | I'll follow up. |
| 06:08:12 | TylerM: | One of us should be the contact with him to follow up |
| 06:08:16 | seven: | TylerM: Please note that down. :- ) |
| 06:08:32 | TylerM: | noted : ) |
| 06:08:39 | jmckenna: | : ) |
| 06:08:49 | seven: | Approval of 501 c3 application status document ( see Tyler's request from Fri, 22 Jan 2010 11:41:13 -0800 ) |
| 06:08:54 | TylerM: | * FOSS4G budget status: no follow up from LOC. |
| 06:09:07 | TylerM: | Nothing new on the 501c3 side of things from me.. |
| 06:09:11 | seven: | Any opinions? |
| 06:09:17 | TylerM: | I'm hunting up a tax attorney to get some direct advice |
| 06:09:26 | seven: | TylerM: Good! |
| 06:09:32 | TylerM: | waiting for returned phone/emails |
| 06:09:57 | TylerM: | If anyone on this channel can recommend one for nonprofit work like ours, please drop me a note |
| 06:10:06 | seven: | Maybe I can explain the "Education stuff" |
| 06:10:22 | seven: | When applying for 501 c( 3 ) you have to specify what you want ot do. |
| 06:10:30 | seven: | One topic tha we chose was "education" |
| 06:10:39 | seven: | This is why there are these detailed questions. |
| 06:11:02 | seven: | TylerM: Are you on the phone? |
| 06:11:06 | crschmidt: | Is the 'education' aspect required? |
| 06:11:07 | FrankW: | TylerM: can you join? |
| 06:11:17 | seven: | FrankW: comments: Bi-Modal mode does not work too well. |
| 06:11:29 | crschmidt: | Or if we said "We no longer claim educational purposes", could we still be 501c3 |
| 06:12:19 | seven: | Tri-Modal communication now. Echoecho |
| 06:12:23 | jmckenna: | funny how we use private mailing list for this but discuss in logged irc chat |
| 06:12:24 | TylerM: | dialing now |
| 06:12:33 | seven: | jmckenna: True |
| 06:12:44 | TylerM: | i just don't like forwarding legal docs to public list that's all |
| 06:12:53 | jmckenna: | good point |
| 06:12:54 | seven: | We might want to include EduCom in this discussion? |
| 06:13:02 | seven: | Waht's your take on this? |
| 06:13:26 | ticheler: | Register OSGeo as non-profit in Europe. Maybe faster :- ) |
| 06:13:43 | markusN: | : ) |
| 06:13:56 | seven: | That is a good question. |
| 06:14:12 | seven: | We might even need to register in many nationalities separately? |
| 06:14:16 | ticheler: | Suggestion ;- ) |
| 06:14:37 | markusN: | we already did: fossgis.de, gfoss.it etc |
| 06:15:07 | seven: | Summarized: We should stick to claim Education as charitable effort. |
| 06:15:14 | TylerM: | ** Education component may be important for keeping FOSS4G/conferences as a primary mission of the org |
| 06:16:38 | TylerM: | ** Tyler to dig up original application for reference |
| 06:17:00 | TylerM: | ** all sponsors feed into core mission |
| 06:17:19 | crschmidt: | bad echo, sorry |
| 06:17:39 | crschmidt: | if someone doesn't have headphones, turn your mic on mute |
| 06:18:08 | seven: | Pls try to turn off al mikes if not speaking. |
| 06:18:18 | TylerM: | i'll type : ) |
| 06:18:20 | seven: | This is so painful. |
| 06:18:22 | seven: | Thanks. |
| 06:18:24 | epifanio: | during the foss4g 2009 cameron shorter sent a mail to the liason officer for each local chapter, to help the site and press release translation, maybe we need the same system for 2010 too |
| 06:18:41 | TylerM: | some input i received said 501c3 should have a larger 'public support' |
| 06:18:52 | TylerM: | componet, versus our current model of a few large corp donors. |
| 06:19:02 | markusN: | in which sense? kind of "petition"? |
| 06:19:35 | FrankW: | As far as I can see we are meeting the public support test without any problem. |
| 06:19:47 | : | * crschmidt puts himself back on mute : ) |
| 06:19:48 | sigq: | osgeofeed: Changeset [3056]: FIX: updated gvSIG install script for 1.9 stable <http://trac.osgeo.org/osgeo/changeset/3056> |
| 06:19:50 | TylerM: | ** FOSS4G income shows broader support - this is important aspect to confirm eligibility as "public support" |
| 06:19:52 | CIA-84: | osgeo: jsanz * r3056 /livedvd/gisvm/trunk/ ( 3 files in 2 dirs ): FIX: updated gvSIG install script for 1.9 stable |
| 06:20:15 | TylerM: | not sure where to go to get my own confidence around that : ) |
| 06:20:21 | TylerM: | so will continue to pursue some more advice |
| 06:20:25 | crschmidt: | I guess we have to respond to this by the 19th. |
| 06:20:26 | seven: | Lets not use the phone unless we have to vote. |
| 06:20:27 | crschmidt: | Which is in two weeks. |
| 06:20:38 | TylerM: | noted |
| 06:20:47 | seven: | Can you all maybe read the letter and my answers. |
| 06:20:58 | seven: | I did not put them there because I was bored to death. |
| 06:21:00 | FrankW: | seven: I will do so |
| 06:21:00 | seven: | :- ) |
| 06:21:10 | seven: | Thanks. |
| 06:21:13 | TylerM: | i can collate all comments and fill in missing answers that remain |
| 06:21:16 | FrankW: | I did skim and they seemed sensible. |
| 06:21:19 | seven: | We should follow up asap via email. |
| 06:21:19 | TylerM: | as well as discuss as hot topics with the irs rep |
| 06:21:22 | TylerM: | if needed. |
| 06:21:27 | seven: | Anything else on this topic right now? |
| 06:21:38 | : | * seven counts 5, 4, 3, ... |
| 06:21:39 | crschmidt: | Do we want to talk on the 15th or so to make sure this is on track? |
| 06:21:40 | TylerM: | not from me.. i just know i need help on it : ) |
| 06:21:45 | TylerM: | so thanks for going through it |
| 06:21:52 | crschmidt: | I don't want to let this slip through. |
| 06:22:00 | seven: | crschmidt: +1 |
| 06:22:09 | crschmidt: | Don't know if we need IRC meeting or something. |
| 06:22:10 | seven: | Woudl be great if you could help keep the flame alive. |
| 06:22:11 | jmckenna: | it seems i missed quite a discussion in that private thread |
| 06:22:19 | jmckenna: | one email is long! wow |
| 06:22:31 | seven: | There is a page in the private Wiki with the letter and some answers filled out. |
| 06:22:31 | crschmidt: | So, I think that we should have a meeting at this same time on the morning of the 15th |
| 06:22:34 | crschmidt: | with anyone who can |
| 06:22:39 | seven: | Good. |
| 06:22:42 | crschmidt: | to evaluate status + discuss any remaining questions. |
| 06:22:49 | TylerM: | +1 |
| 06:22:51 | seven: | TylerM: Can you add that to the agenda please? |
| 06:22:57 | crschmidt: | I'll send an email to the board list to that affect when we are done here. |
| 06:23:01 | TylerM: | yep |
| 06:23:01 | seven: | Cool. . |
| 06:23:06 | FrankW: | crschmidt: I agree, good idea. |
| 06:23:10 | crschmidt: | Frank has to leave in 7 minutes, is there anything else that we need to vote on while we have a quorom? |
| 06:23:21 | TylerM: | ** '''SPECIAL MEETING''' - same meeting time ( 15h00 UTC ) on Feb 15th |
| 06:23:26 | seven: | # Setup Wolf to continue as Summer of Code admin contact for 2010 ( Tyler ) ? |
| 06:23:37 | seven: | motion, plusone, done |
| 06:23:40 | crschmidt: | I think that's fine/simple |
| 06:23:40 | crschmidt: | yeah |
| 06:23:54 | TylerM: | Just need to confirm him that he's done a great job and should continue as our admin contact : ) |
| 06:23:58 | : | * seven motions to setup Wolf to continue as Summer of Code admin contact for 2010 |
| 06:23:59 | jmckenna: | can someone explain in 10 words what the special meeting is about? it seems this long email thread contains many topics |
| 06:24:16 | hobu: | +1 |
| 06:24:18 | seven: | +1 |
| 06:24:19 | markusN: | +1 |
| 06:24:19 | crschmidt: | +1 |
| 06:24:23 | FrankW: | Wolf rocks! |
| 06:24:28 | seven: | Yeah. |
| 06:24:31 | crschmidt: | jmckenna: Establishing a response to the IRS 501c3 communication. |
| 06:24:35 | crschmidt: | jmckenna: Which has to be returned by the 19th. |
| 06:24:35 | seven: | Thanks to __wolf__ |
| 06:24:44 | TylerM: | frank seconds, all were in favour |
| 06:24:50 | jmckenna: | crschmidt: ah ok thanks. |
| 06:24:58 | seven: | OK. Frank, you are dismissed. :- ) |
| 06:25:03 | crschmidt: | Thanks Frank. |
| 06:25:08 | FrankW: | I should note I failed to produce the draft budget, but will plan to do so fairly soon. |
| 06:25:20 | jmckenna: | i did not vote as i do not know wolf or his work |
| 06:25:25 | FrankW: | Now I flee.... |
| 06:25:32 | seven: | Bye. |
| 06:25:39 | markusN: | thanks |
| 06:25:45 | seven: | What needs to be said about: http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Proposed_Board_Election_Procedure ? |
| 06:25:47 | sigq: | Title: Proposed Board Election Procedure - OSGeo Wiki ( at wiki.osgeo.org ) |
| 06:25:53 | TylerM: | not sure who added that... |
| 06:26:00 | TylerM: | just must have been a reminder to get the process going |
| 06:26:01 | : | * seven holds her breath - arewe ready to go on? |
| 06:26:10 | markusN: | the relevant changes seem to be http://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php?title=Proposed_Board_Election_Procedure&diff=44125&oldid=44122 |
| 06:26:12 | sigq: | Title: Proposed Board Election Procedure - OSGeo Wiki ( at wiki.osgeo.org ) |
| 06:26:31 | markusN: | "They may not cast multiple votes for one candidate." |
| 06:26:43 | TylerM: | ah yes, right : ) |
| 06:26:45 | seven: | Ah, OK. I remember now. Is it good for approval, or does it need more polishing? |
| 06:26:46 | TylerM: | sorry forgot. |
| 06:26:51 | TylerM: | it is good for approval |
| 06:26:59 | seven: | Discussion? |
| 06:27:00 | markusN: | looks good |
| 06:27:04 | : | * crschmidt thought we already voted on this, but thinks it is good |
| 06:27:06 | jmckenna: | approval here |
| 06:27:18 | seven: | Cool. Anybody care to make it a motion? |
| 06:27:22 | seven: | Ah - but Frank is gone now. |
| 06:27:24 | seven: | :-( |
| 06:27:29 | TylerM: | it's okay you have 5 people still |
| 06:27:35 | seven: | Lets keep it for next time. Is that OK? |
| 06:27:43 | markusN: | motion to accept changes in "Proposed Board Election Procedure" |
| 06:27:52 | seven: | OK. On the mike. Somone make the motion please. |
| 06:27:55 | crschmidt: | second motion |
| 06:28:02 | jmckenna: | +1 |
| 06:28:10 | markusN: | +1 |
| 06:28:11 | hobu: | +1 |
| 06:28:12 | seven: | +1 |
| 06:28:16 | crschmidt: | +1 |
| 06:28:21 | TylerM: | jmkenna on voice? |
| 06:28:23 | TylerM: | great |
| 06:28:24 | seven: | Cool, thanks. |
| 06:28:34 | crschmidt: | No budget, no Ravi |
| 06:28:36 | seven: | Next topic: |
| 06:28:36 | TylerM: | we'll have the same to do for charter elections as well later |
| 06:28:37 | seven: | Report from Arnulf: US Export Restriction enforcement by sf.net renders some projects useless for OSGeo members. Discussion ensued in the Spanish list. |
| 06:28:54 | seven: | There was some racket on the ES mailing list |
| 06:28:56 | TylerM: | really nice :P |
| 06:29:09 | markusN: | they want us to host projects? |
| 06:29:10 | seven: | because sf.net recently started to enfoce the export regulations. |
| 06:29:22 | markusN: | ( like google for some time ) |
| 06:29:24 | TylerM: | what does 'enforce' look like? |
| 06:29:32 | TylerM: | blocking via geo ip? |
| 06:29:33 | seven: | This means that one of the Spanish board members cannot use GeoNetwork infrastructure ( and others ) any more. |
| 06:29:34 | markusN: | no cuba etc |
| 06:29:35 | crschmidt: | TylerM: I think it's IP-based limits on downloads, yes. |
| 06:29:43 | TylerM: | unbelievable |
| 06:29:53 | jmckenna: | wow |
| 06:30:02 | seven: | I pointed them to our Export regulations page but it is not approved yet ba the board. |
| 06:30:16 | crschmidt: | Which page is that? |
| 06:30:16 | seven: | I believe that I warnocked the discussion at one point. |
| 06:30:32 | seven: | Trie to do the same on the ES board meeting but did not work out. |
| 06:30:37 | seven: | They are stubborn. |
| 06:30:38 | seven: | :- ) |
| 06:30:50 | seven: | http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/US_Export_Restrictions |
| 06:30:53 | sigq: | Title: US Export Restrictions - OSGeo Wiki ( at wiki.osgeo.org ) |
| 06:31:04 | TylerM: | should we just be planning to have a hosting mirror in europe? |
| 06:31:08 | TylerM: | to ease concern? |
| 06:31:13 | TylerM: | crschmidt: http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/US_Export_Restrictions |
| 06:31:15 | markusN: | use http://www.osor.eu/ instead? |
| 06:31:15 | sigq: | Title: US Export Restrictions - OSGeo Wiki ( at wiki.osgeo.org ) |
| 06:31:17 | sigq: | Title: OSOR.eu - Open Source Observatory and Repository ( at www.osor.eu ) |
| 06:31:31 | TylerM: | Could we get a 'branch' on osor infrastructure?? |
| 06:32:19 | markusN: | sure |
| 06:32:29 | crschmidt: | So, right now, we're hosted only in the US. Moving infrastructure from SF to OSGeo to avoid export restrictions seems... problematic. |
| 06:32:32 | markusN: | just register AFAIK |
| 06:32:33 | jmckenna: | interesting - i often hear negative smirks about our US-based foundation during my travels. what could hurt having a branch? |
| 06:32:49 | crschmidt: | Setting up two different development infrastructures -- SVN, trac, etc. -- is difficult to reconcile. |
| 06:32:59 | markusN: | also mirror sites are used in some OSGeo projects |
| 06:33:01 | crschmidt: | That is, how do you have tickets managed in two places |
| 06:33:04 | markusN: | for > 10 years |
| 06:33:06 | seven: | crschmidt: That was also my impression. |
| 06:33:13 | seven: | The same applies to OSOR. |
| 06:33:16 | crschmidt: | It seems to me that exporting technology to another place just to get around restrictions isn't much better. |
| 06:33:19 | seven: | I talked to them about this two years back. |
| 06:33:20 | TylerM: | I'm just thinking of downloads availability |
| 06:33:41 | TylerM: | but i guess there's much more to the issue. |
| 06:33:42 | markusN: | we could start ( and stop? ) with download, not a full clone |
| 06:33:43 | seven: | But they run GFroge and are reluctant to set up mirrors. Too much work they do not have folks for. |
| 06:33:45 | crschmidt: | That is: we are moving software from one place to another with the intention that we are making it available in violation of what would be export restrictions. |
| 06:34:01 | TylerM: | jmckenna: we'll get our 501c3 figured then decide to switch to Canada ;- ) |
| 06:34:05 | TylerM: | lol |
| 06:34:18 | hobu: | crschmidt: no, just you and I are, not the canadians and germans :P |
| 06:34:37 | jmckenna: | ha |
| 06:34:38 | crschmidt: | So, we can encourage people to move from SF to OSGeo. |
| 06:34:38 | seven: | hobu: Wait |
| 06:34:43 | seven: | Nonono. |
| 06:34:43 | TylerM: | yeah we just want to make sure we have continued access to our ( legal ) copy : ) |
| 06:34:47 | seven: | We are not breaking anything. |
| 06:34:49 | seven: | Slow down. |
| 06:34:55 | seven: | We are not! |
| 06:35:12 | seven: | There is no code in our software - as far as I can tell - that falls under the regulation. |
| 06:35:29 | seven: | The problem of SF is that they have loads of software they do not know intimately and thuis |
| 06:35:33 | crschmidt: | The wiki page says "OSGeo software and/or technical data may NOT be exported/reexported, either directly or indirectly, to any destination subject to U.S. embargoes or trade sanctions unless formally authorized by the U.S. Government." -- http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/US_Export_Restrictions |
| 06:35:34 | seven: | they just close it down. |
| 06:35:36 | sigq: | Title: US Export Restrictions - OSGeo Wiki ( at wiki.osgeo.org ) |
| 06:35:37 | TylerM: | it's usually 'security' related stuff that's an issue, right? |
| 06:35:40 | crschmidt: | So I am reading that. |
| 06:36:07 | seven: | "Exported" is a different thing altogether to collaborate. |
| 06:36:09 | TylerM: | iirc, OSSIM guys have worked through this too.. |
| 06:36:33 | hobu: | the same issue crops up if some US-classified bit of code ends up in an open source project -- liability for the US board members. |
| 06:36:40 | seven: | Apache Foundation has found an additional bit in the law that exempts collabortaion on distributed projects. |
| 06:36:48 | markusN: | [do we still need the phone? costs a lot here] |
| 06:36:54 | crschmidt: | markusN: no |
| 06:36:57 | TylerM: | shouldn't need it |
| 06:36:59 | crschmidt: | I think we can abandon the phone. |
| 06:37:12 | crschmidt: | Sorry for the cost. |
| 06:37:14 | TylerM: | done : ) |
| 06:37:22 | crschmidt: | Don't have a 1-800 number benefactor : ) |
| 06:37:26 | seven: | But once someone explicitly "exports" OSGeo software to an evil-axis state they have to be sure not to break the law in the uS. |
| 06:37:35 | : | * TylerM has skype credits if anyone needs them |
| 06:37:37 | : | * seven is not sure whether she is still intelligible. |
| 06:37:53 | jmckenna: | seven: ditto |
| 06:38:03 | crschmidt: | Okay. |
| 06:38:12 | crschmidt: | This wiki page is very unclear. |
| 06:38:22 | TylerM: | seven: it's not perfectly clear.. but it is obvious the law was intended for the days of selling a disk to middle east... not for todays collaboration environment. |
| 06:38:32 | seven: | Yes. |
| 06:38:36 | crschmidt: | I believe what seven is saying is that 'Collaborating on a project is okay. OSGeo has no export-restricted code that we are aware of. therefore, hosting on OSGeo should be fine." |
| 06:38:41 | seven: | crschmidt: Can you bring light into that page? |
| 06:38:45 | TylerM: | where contributors are from such a wide pool |
| 06:38:51 | crschmidt: | Well, I have to understand the situation better first. |
| 06:39:10 | crschmidt: | I don't know export regulations well: I was under the impression that to *some locations*, you can't give them anything. |
| 06:39:14 | crschmidt: | For example, Cuba. |
| 06:39:20 | seven: | No. |
| 06:39:35 | seven: | It is only a list of restricted stuff - and we do not have any of this. |
| 06:39:44 | crschmidt: | Okay. |
| 06:39:51 | crschmidt: | So OSGeo believes that it has no export-restricted technology. |
| 06:39:52 | TylerM: | I get asked for export control number stuff from people every month or so |
| 06:39:57 | seven: | I am not sure about OSSIM, but Marc Lucas might be able to check that. |
| 06:40:05 | TylerM: | i.e. from large systems integrators |
| 06:40:14 | crschmidt: | And therefore, it is in the best interest of OSGeo projects to move their infrastructure to OSGeo. |
| 06:40:14 | jmckenna: | sounds like we need to contact a lawyer. shouldn't we stop spinning wheels discussing and contact a professional? |
| 06:40:17 | seven: | This is why I set up that Wiki page in the first place. |
| 06:40:26 | TylerM: | but I tell them we don't need numbers.. so they just carry on : ) |
| 06:40:29 | seven: | No lawyer. |
| 06:40:44 | crschmidt: | jmckenna: Before we pay a lawyer, we have to do our best to establish what our goals are. |
| 06:40:46 | seven: | They do not make sense in this respect. Believe me. |
| 06:40:52 | crschmidt: | Also likely true. |
| 06:41:00 | crschmidt: | A lawyer would just say "Block Cuba. Problem solved." |
| 06:41:03 | crschmidt: | See: Google. SF.net. |
| 06:41:12 | seven: | I think the problem is much smaller than it appears. |
| 06:41:12 | TylerM: | I'll follow up with Mark Lucas or John Weathersby and see if they could talk to the point for us during March's board meeting, if desired |
| 06:41:16 | crschmidt: | Okay. |
| 06:41:19 | seven: | TylerM: Good. |
| 06:41:21 | jmckenna: | it seems like a serious issue to me, that's all. |
| 06:41:34 | crschmidt: | TylerM: Please keep me in the loop on the discussions, and I will do my best to look into this as well. |
| 06:41:41 | seven: | Apart from this the whole logic behind export restrictions for Free Software is a bad joke. |
| 06:41:43 | : | * crschmidt has people he can talk to for some advice. |
| 06:41:52 | seven: | crschmidt: Good. |
| 06:41:53 | TylerM: | ok |
| 06:42:01 | TylerM: | it does seem important now that we hear crazy big headlines like sf.net :P |
| 06:42:06 | TylerM: | more FUD |
| 06:42:09 | TylerM: | against foss |
| 06:42:12 | crschmidt: | Eh |
| 06:42:16 | jmckenna: | darn |
| 06:42:21 | seven: | I proposed to pb_pb in Cuba that he can use my server as a proxy. |
| 06:42:22 | crschmidt: | SF.net *does* have technology prohibited by export restrictions. |
| 06:42:25 | seven: | Problme solved. |
| 06:42:33 | seven: | At least the practical bit. |
| 06:42:48 | crschmidt: | So, before the next board meeting, I will take on the task of clarifying our export statement wikipage. |
| 06:42:48 | seven: | As long as nobody is stepping on our feet I see no need to do anything else. |
| 06:42:59 | crschmidt: | So our scribe can make that a task for me. |
| 06:43:00 | TylerM: | John W. who I mentioned was involved in some security related stuff around openssl iirc |
| 06:43:05 | nhv: | afaik OSSIM has a plugin architecture so as to be able to keep main codebase exportable amongst other thingd |
| 06:43:10 | TylerM: | crschmidt: great will do |
| 06:43:24 | seven: | hobu: , crschmidt: what's your take on this. You are US citizens. |
| 06:43:27 | TylerM: | nhv: John would be a good one to talk to right? |
| 06:43:56 | crschmidt: | seven: I don't know enough to have a take. I do know that if we have restricted technology, it would probably be an unsmart move to explicitly state that we are attempting to circumvent those. |
| 06:43:56 | TylerM: | seven: I thought citizenship didn't matter in US... that our 'corp' is the citizen here |
| 06:44:03 | nhv: | you could talk to Mark HJG would just say if I can't freely distribute it I won't touch it |
| 06:44:19 | crschmidt: | TylerM: I think he's asking for opinions as citizens who know the USG better. |
| 06:44:43 | crschmidt: | Anyway, I'll do some research and let the board know what information I have. |
| 06:44:44 | TylerM: | yeah, hobu's got a concern about being a director too for liability sake. |
| 06:44:48 | TylerM: | sounds good |
| 06:44:56 | crschmidt: | In the meantime, we should encourage projects to move from SF.net to OSGeo infrastructure. |
| 06:45:02 | crschmidt: | Since centralized infrastructure is better anyway. |
| 06:45:04 | seven: | Actually I am asking you also as a citizen who has to live in the US, liability and all. |
| 06:45:07 | crschmidt: | And SF.net sucks : ) |
| 06:45:12 | seven: | He. |
| 06:45:16 | crschmidt: | Sure. I'm not particularly worried about it. |
| 06:45:27 | jmckenna: | how many projects are we talking about? huge task? |
| 06:45:34 | crschmidt: | I think it is unlikely that the USG is really going to care, and even if they did, the result would be to ask us to stop doing it, not to sue us. |
| 06:46:07 | jmckenna: | i seem to ask all the dumb questions tonight..err this morning. |
| 06:46:13 | seven: | crschmidt: Exactly. Then we still have time to move somewhere else / think up whatever is needed. |
| 06:46:31 | TylerM: | jmckenna: I'm not sure |
| 06:46:36 | crschmidt: | jmckenna: I think a relatively small number of projects use non-OSGeo infrastructure. But we have a small number of projects total : ) |
| 06:46:37 | TylerM: | can't be too many |
| 06:46:45 | seven: | jmckenna: We would need to check, I just know of GN because it was directly in question in that discussion. |
| 06:46:55 | crschmidt: | Anyway, for now, we can encourage people to move to centralized hosting. |
| 06:46:56 | jmckenna: | hmm ok. |
| 06:47:03 | crschmidt: | And hopefully by next meeting we cna have a more clear statement on export restrictions. |
| 06:47:03 | seven: | Yes. |
| 06:47:11 | seven: | Good. |
| 06:47:19 | : | * seven is done with this topic. Anything else? |
| 06:47:30 | : | * TylerM goes to wash his hands ;- ) |
| 06:47:33 | TylerM: | yuck : ) |
| 06:47:38 | crschmidt: | Update from each director is next on the agenda. |
| 06:47:40 | seven: | New regular topics: |
| 06:47:47 | seven: | Markus' stay in Japan: OSGeo.jp and MEXT ministerial project |
| 06:47:51 | TylerM: | ravi is here now.. |
| 06:47:59 | seven: | Thanks markusN for adding this! |
| 06:48:01 | ravivundavalli: | Was I late ?? |
| 06:48:06 | TylerM: | ravivundavalli: sorry for changing meeting times. I guess you got mixed up? |
| 06:48:13 | seven: | Hey ravivundavalli. |
| 06:48:21 | markusN: | I Ravi |
| 06:48:23 | markusN: | Hi |
| 06:48:24 | TylerM: | Director updates ++ |
| 06:48:26 | ravivundavalli: | Hi all good evening |
| 06:48:29 | jmckenna: | hi ravi |
| 06:48:39 | markusN: | Re MEXT: I think it is great that OSGeo.jp got a ministerial project |
| 06:48:44 | ravivundavalli: | So U made it Jeff |
| 06:48:51 | markusN: | maybe the first local chapter ever |
| 06:48:51 | jmckenna: | yes yes, ha |
| 06:49:48 | : | * jmckenna lets markus talk |
| 06:50:25 | markusN: | jeff and me are perfectly shifted with our presence in Japan : ) |
| 06:50:31 | markusN: | so he continues now |
| 06:51:05 | markusN: | Focus ( for me ) was on GRASS internationalization ( essentially winGRASS, now generated daily at http://josef.fsv.cvut.cz/wingrass/grass64/ ) |
| 06:51:06 | sigq: | Title: Index of /wingrass/grass64 ( at josef.fsv.cvut.cz ) |
| 06:51:28 | markusN: | and preparation of tutorials for remote sensing based on Japanese satellite data |
| 06:51:34 | markusN: | great stuff for me : ) |
| 06:51:41 | markusN: | see the wiki for material |
| 06:51:43 | TylerM: | jmckenna: and you're doing some OSGeo4W stuff? |
| 06:51:47 | TylerM: | cool |
| 06:52:01 | jmckenna: | yes sorry i was letting markus report. if you wish i can talk |
| 06:52:01 | markusN: | it will go on for 1-3 years ( idea was 3 but the government changed there, so we'll see ) |
| 06:52:07 | ravivundavalli: | OSGeo4W Great |
| 06:52:19 | markusN: | to finish: we are also working on exchanging students etc |
| 06:52:23 | markusN: | jeff - go! |
| 06:52:27 | jmckenna: | ha! |
| 06:52:45 | TylerM: | they have funding for all of us to go and help on our favourite software? ;- ) lo |
| 06:53:26 | TylerM: | any more on this topic? |
| 06:53:36 | TylerM: | or is jeff madly typing a long answer? ;- ) |
| 06:53:43 | markusN: | I guess so |
| 06:53:48 | jmckenna: | first i think the osgeo-jp community has strongly supported osgeo/foss4g since beginning. they bring so many community members to their country...long story short: there is an "OSGeo Cafe" here and also an "OSGeo Bike" that you get a key for on arrival. enough said. |
| 06:53:48 | markusN: | given the time there :p |
| 06:53:52 | TylerM: | heh |
| 06:54:00 | markusN: | yeah the bike is cool |
| 06:54:05 | jmckenna: | and yes they are allowing me to give OSGeo4W love |
| 06:54:19 | seven: | Cool story. Thanks! |
| 06:54:20 | TylerM: | via Osaka and Venka? |
| 06:54:44 | seven: | Last topic: Committee reports |
| 06:54:48 | seven: | _blank |
| 06:54:49 | seven: | :- ) |
| 06:54:59 | TylerM: | seven: what about director reports? seems you never want to do them? ;- ) lol |
| 06:55:09 | TylerM: | I personally really would like to hear some : ) |
| 06:55:15 | TylerM: | makes me feel less isolated : ) |
| 06:55:18 | seven: | Well, we just had two at the same time! :- ) |
| 06:55:22 | markusN: | TylerM: yes, Venka and Mori |
| 06:55:31 | TylerM: | yes a good start : ) |
| 06:55:41 | : | * seven has to run, sorry. |
| 06:55:48 | seven: | TylerM: How is the Journal working our. |
| 06:55:54 | TylerM: | ok more next time i hope |
| 06:55:55 | seven: | our -> out |
| 06:55:55 | TylerM: | going slow... |
| 06:56:04 | TylerM: | but should have a few articles done in next week or two |
| 06:56:06 | : | * jmckenna yes partners are Venka ( OSU ) and APPLIED TECHNOLOGY CO.,LTD |
| 06:56:07 | TylerM: | then push it out |
| 06:56:16 | seven: | All: Please, please make sure your stuff is available soon! |
| 06:56:23 | markusN: | sorry: forgot to mention the OSGeo.jp party for the japanese translation of the GRASS book ; ) |
| 06:56:31 | TylerM: | Also got clear direction on some sponsorship leads I'm pursuing |
| 06:56:52 | jmckenna: | markusN: ah sounds like fun! i will ask how it was |
| 06:56:58 | seven: | Good. Please wrap up via Email as a reminder and for those boardies that did not make it. |
| 06:57:00 | markusN: | cool it was |
| 06:57:12 | TylerM: | okay.. motion to close? |
| 06:57:19 | seven: | ! second |
| 06:57:21 | jmckenna: | and thanks for the bike chain oil. osgeo bike runs well |
| 06:57:21 | seven: | +1 |
| 06:57:27 | jmckenna: | +1 |
| 06:57:29 | seven: | jmckenna: :- ) |
| 06:57:32 | TylerM: | thanks for coming. |
| 06:57:37 | seven: | Thanks all & bye. |
| 06:57:37 | markusN: | jmckenna: sure : ) |
| 06:57:37 | TylerM: | sorry we missed you ravi! |
| 06:57:40 | markusN: | +1 |
| 06:57:47 | TylerM: | I'm sure a few of us would still like to chat with you now though |
| 06:57:49 | ravivundavalli: | +1 |
| 06:58:05 | TylerM: | ======== Meeting closed ====== |
| 06:58:15 | markusN: | thanks & bye |
| 06:58:19 | TylerM: | note next meeting, is special, on 15th, same time ( 1 hour ago ).. |
| 06:58:32 | TylerM: | to review 501c3 us charitable application status. |
| 06:59:03 | ravivundavalli: | Good to have caught the last 15 min at the least |
| 06:59:15 | jmckenna: | i feel the board is trying to ignore F2F talk. is there any interest to meet F2F? It seems only arnulf, ravi and i see the importance. please correct me if i am wrong. |
| 06:59:26 | ravivundavalli: | Godd night all |
| 06:59:44 | TylerM: | I think there is interest, but likely not in traveling so far for many |
| 06:59:57 | TylerM: | e.g. at least 4-5 of us from North America : ) |
| 06:59:58 | jmckenna: | then please suggest a place |
| 07:00:07 | ravivundavalli: | yup I actually wanted to seek a vote on F2F |
| 07:00:09 | TylerM: | I'm on the sidelines a bit on this one : ) |
| 07:00:23 | TylerM: | If we could start a wiki page on the idea, I think that would help |
| 07:00:29 | TylerM: | to get idea of costs, timing, etc. |
| 07:00:39 | TylerM: | People need a proposal to throw tomatoes at : ) |
| 07:01:20 | TylerM: | one big question is cost of course, since most directors have no large travel budget |
| 07:01:41 | : | * crschmidt doesn't have the $$ to do much/any travel, and doesn't think that f2f board meetings are more important than educating foss4g users in India ( for example ) |
| 07:02:15 | TylerM: | but if we can offset that using osgeo funds ( a question for treasurer ) or organise an event somewhere that both helps the local group ( by using directors knowledge ) and gives us a chance to meet... |
| 07:02:20 | ravivundavalli: | It is coming to a full circle |
| 07:02:21 | TylerM: | then I think there is a great plan : ) |
| 07:02:46 | ravivundavalli: | It started with me worried about the $$ for an F2F |
| 07:03:12 | ravivundavalli: | So venka suggested on F2F in India |
| 07:03:16 | TylerM: | on cost side, it'd be easy to chew up all the profits of FOSS4G with a trip for the board almost anywhere outside of north am. and europe : ) |
| 07:03:48 | CIA-84: | osgeo: jsanz * r3057 /livedvd/gisvm/trunk/bin/install_gvsig.sh: FIX: polishing the gvSIG install script |
| 07:03:50 | TylerM: | ravivundavalli: yes, your concern is universal for others too |
| 07:03:50 | sigq: | osgeofeed: Changeset [3057]: FIX: polishing the gvSIG install script <http://trac.osgeo.org/osgeo/changeset/3057> |
| 07:05:10 | TylerM: | So we can either plan to meet at a special event ( one that might bring some income to offset costs and make sure everyone can come ), or plan to meet at an event where some of us will already be ( e.g. 3 of us will be in nottingham in June for OSGIS ).. or... what else hmm |
| 07:05:16 | TylerM: | the challenge is to make it valuable on several fronts : ) |
| 07:05:17 | ravivundavalli: | the F2F OSGeo India planned is for the board to visit and exchange their valuable experience with Indian stake holders |
| 07:05:25 | TylerM: | +1 |
| 07:05:50 | TylerM: | How many people could attend and could we charge for the event? |
| 07:06:16 | jmckenna: | huge +1. why do only a few of us see the importance, to bring the Board to India to represent OSGeo? frustrating. |
| 07:06:36 | TylerM: | jmckenna: all the way to India is no small trip |
| 07:06:38 | TylerM: | for most |
| 07:07:12 | TylerM: | I would not say it is 'important to bring the Board to India'.. but it can be beneficial, yes I agree |
| 07:07:17 | jmckenna: | ok then please suggest other locations |
| 07:07:39 | crschmidt: | jmckenna: I don't see it as more important to bring the *board* to india than it is to bring OSGeo software + educational resources to India. |
| 07:07:45 | jmckenna: | i give up. i mentioned india to arnulf and venka in sydney. |
| 07:07:50 | crschmidt: | jmckenna: An equal amount of money invested in each gives a far different result. |
| 07:08:05 | ticheler: | Bolsena ;P |
| 07:08:09 | jmckenna: | then please suggest boston maybe? halifax is doable for me also. um, we need to meet. |
| 07:08:13 | jmckenna: | yeah true. |
| 07:08:17 | ravivundavalli: | +1 to schmidt |
| 07:08:21 | crschmidt: | I think that any practical Board F2F just needs to look at how to conserve costs the most; either doing it: |
| 07:08:26 | crschmidt: | 1. at foss4g ( which we've already stated ) |
| 07:08:35 | crschmidt: | or 2. At some place which is cheap enough to get to to make it cost effective. |
| 07:08:45 | crschmidt: | I could be wrong, but I don't think India is it when half of our board is in N.Am. |
| 07:08:54 | ravivundavalli: | we wish the board would drive a point in India about OSGeo software |
| 07:09:07 | jmckenna: | yes that is it |
| 07:09:19 | jmckenna: | that is why i pushed for s africa and sydney |
| 07:09:30 | jmckenna: | and look what that has done for those communities |
| 07:09:36 | jmckenna: | we can do the same for india |
| 07:09:58 | TylerM: | I think you're mixing up a couple ideas here.. FOSS4G and board meetings are two separate things : ) |
| 07:10:03 | : | * crschmidt nods at TylerM |
| 07:10:15 | jmckenna: | anyway....this should have been the ENTIRE discussion during our board meeting. instead...well anyway darn. |
| 07:10:30 | jmckenna: | i am mixedup |
| 07:10:32 | crschmidt: | Most of the board wasn't even in Sydney, so saying "Look waht it did for sydney is irrelevant." |
| 07:10:36 | crschmidt: | It is 2AM : ) |
| 07:10:37 | crschmidt: | go to sleep. |
| 07:10:39 | TylerM: | meeting f2f is not a priority for the board, where's the mystery in that? ; ) |
| 07:10:48 | CIA-84: | osgeo: sbcalvo * r3058 /livedvd/gisvm/trunk/bin/ ( 3 files ): Updated to the Kosmo 2.0 RC1 version. install_kosmo_2beta.sh has been removed |
| 07:11:24 | jmckenna: | nice talk. ok thanks guys |
| 07:11:26 | TylerM: | jmckenna: I hope you'll write up a report for the annual report showing all the values of sydney etc too : ) that goes a long way to encouraging continued suport for FOSS4G in those kinds of regions |
| 07:12:06 | ravivundavalli: | Thnak all those who think of an F2F Board meet to proliferate OSGeo |
| 07:12:58 | TylerM: | ravivundavalli: I think it will take some organisation of the idea before anyone will commit.. but some kind of meeting could be doable, especially for the consultants who would like to be there in person as well |
| 07:13:54 | ravivundavalli: | so I had a bit of discussion after all.. |
| 07:14:26 | TylerM: | yes : ) |
| 07:14:28 | sigq: | osgeofeed: Changeset [3059]: Updated Kosmo definition and description to the Kosmo 2.0 RC1 version <http://trac.osgeo.org/osgeo/changeset/3059> |
| 07:14:43 | ravivundavalli: | Good night, day etc |
| 07:14:52 | TylerM: | thank you - you too |
| 07:15:00 | CIA-84: | osgeo: sbcalvo * r3059 /livedvd/gisvm/trunk/doc/descriptions/ ( kosmo_definition.html kosmo_description.html ): Updated Kosmo definition and description to the Kosmo 2.0 RC1 version |
| 07:32:07 | TylerM: | jmckenna: you forgot that ravi wasn't at the meeting in time, hence skipping the f2f discussion |
| 07:32:24 | TylerM: | wasn't because of lack of interest |
| 07:42:41 | : | * _wolf_ thanks the board for the vote of confidence :D |
| 08:39:17 | wildintellect: | TylerM, still got those notes from the Plone foundation - I can put you in touch with their board... |
| 08:50:47 | wildintellect: | http://svn.plone.org/svn/collective/PloneFoundationDocs/501c3/ for those on the board, this is a good example to compare against our application |
| 08:51:39 | TylerM: | thx wildintellect |
| 08:54:40 | : | * wildintellect notes that Plone consulted the Software Freedom Law Center on their application |
| 08:55:08 | TylerM: | good pointer too |
| 08:55:19 | wildintellect: | they have a lawyer from there on the papers |
| 08:56:15 | wildintellect: | EFF might be the other place to look for a lawyer familiar with this stuff |
| 09:01:14 | wildintellect: | TylerM, any thoughts on next steps with the servers, I didn't hear back from OSL on my questions yet |
| 09:02:06 | : | * wildintellect notes pramsey will be disappointed that even if we get the order in Dell is unlikely to ship before the 18th, so no servers by sprint |
| 09:04:25 | TylerM: | wildintellect: hmm.. just got a note back from him, but you weren't in the cc by accident i guess.. so I just sent you a copy |
| 09:04:59 | TylerM: | They could still have a transition prep sprint.. writing scripts for us to run later to package stuff up for the move ;- ) |
| 09:05:11 | TylerM: | We all know we can be replaced with a shell script :o |
| 09:07:34 | wildintellect: | I agree, there are still a lot of planning that needs to be done so the server turn around can be fast |
| 09:08:12 | wildintellect: | too bad I didn't remember there was a board meeting |
| 09:08:33 | wildintellect: | I do think the extra $1500 for the better drives is worth it |
| 09:09:23 | wildintellect: | and no one else has chimed in about RAID 5 v 6 |
| 10:00:06 | TylerM: | did lance's answers solidify things for you? |
| 10:00:29 | TylerM: | wildintellect: chance to get total down and include the better drives? |
| 10:01:11 | TylerM: | i wouldn't worry too much about the difference though it just means getting confirmation from the board or treasurer that it'd be okay |
| 10:01:19 | TylerM: | FrankW may already have a thought on that |
| 10:01:37 | TylerM: | ( going 1500 over budget on the servers to have better drives ) |
| 10:04:29 | crschmidt: | Define 'better'? |
| 10:27:57 | TylerM: | i'll leave it to wildintellect to define crschmidt : ) |
| 10:28:10 | : | * crschmidt tried to skim the SAC list, didn't see it |
| 11:28:01 | TylerM: | anyone a pro at using adwords? |
| 11:28:06 | TylerM: | couldn't make it more complicated.. at least for me :P |
| 11:28:12 | TylerM: | biab |
| 11:33:50 | FrankW: | wildintellect, TylerM: I think 1500 over our budget for the hardware is significant and would require new authorization. |
| 11:33:56 | FrankW: | I'd rather find a way to trim within the budget. |
| 12:13:09 | hobu: | per or total? if it's total it isn't IMO |
| 12:25:21 | crschmidt: | I'd like to see a final outline of the two choices we're looking at; it's not clear to me what we're trading by being over/under budget. |
| 13:18:12 | TylerM: | crschmidt: Alex is working on it... he'll summarise when his dust has settled, don't worry |
| 15:02:04 | CIA-84: | osgeo: tmitchell * r3060 /marketing/ ( 6 files in 3 dirs ): funding appeal letter page |
| 15:02:04 | sigq: | osgeofeed: Changeset [3060]: funding appeal letter page <http://trac.osgeo.org/osgeo/changeset/3060> |
| 19:09:28 | : | * wildintellect is now available to take questions about the potential servers |
| 19:10:31 | crschmidt: | wildintellect: what is the difference between the disks? |
| 19:12:46 | wildintellect: | 146Gb 15K rpm 3 Gb/s vs 146 10K 6GB/s vs 300GB 15K 6GB/s ( All are 6 drives total ) |
| 19:13:34 | wildintellect: | there is a weird oddity where if we only put 6 2.5 in 300GB drives in the 8 slot chasis that it might be under budget ( need to double check ) |
| 19:14:02 | wildintellect: | 2.5 in drives on a server seems kinda strange though, if they were originally meant /designed for laptops |
| 19:14:43 | crschmidt: | is that orderedd from least to most expensive? |
| 19:15:07 | wildintellect: | no, mid, low, high |
| 19:15:12 | crschmidt: | Okay. |
| 19:15:17 | crschmidt: | And low is the only one that comes in under budget? |
| 19:15:53 | wildintellect: | I think either 146 drive option is under budget |
| 19:16:09 | crschmidt: | Okay. |
| 19:16:13 | crschmidt: | I'd go with the low, I think. |
| 19:16:29 | crschmidt: | 1. I don't see us needing a ton of disk. |
| 19:17:06 | crschmidt: | Actually, I take that back; I'd go with the first one. |
| 19:17:08 | crschmidt: | 1. Still stands, |
| 19:17:22 | wildintellect: | someone else did mention some concern about filled disks - at 500-700GB it's only about double current capacity |
| 19:17:23 | crschmidt: | 2. I think we're likely to have more desire for fast seeks than throughput. |
| 19:17:35 | wildintellect: | I tend to agree |
| 19:17:46 | crschmidt: | I don't think that we're in a position where our current capacity is really stretched other than because we've been lazy. |
| 19:17:54 | wildintellect: | it is also possible to not have identical servers |
| 19:18:08 | crschmidt: | ( For example, of our current 250GB capacity, I recently found 80GB in uncleaned up backups from several years ago ) |
| 19:18:09 | wildintellect: | and get one with small disks and one with large, that might fit in the budget |
| 19:19:19 | wildintellect: | the one with large disks could be RAID 6 and have the backups and the smaller one RAID 5 with the more intensive web stuff |
| 19:19:30 | crschmidt: | That seems reasonable. |
| 19:20:19 | wildintellect: | not sure if that made the logs yet FrankW might want to see the last 10 min |
| 19:25:11 | FrankW: | One with more disk space than the other sounds fine to me. |
| 19:27:43 | wildintellect: | any thought on if default 2 port nic is good enough? |
| 19:27:56 | crschmidt: | Yes. |
| 19:29:31 | wildintellect: | well assuming we get as good a deal as the last discount Tyler got from them price will be $14555.82 |
| 19:29:53 | crschmidt: | Okay. |
| 19:30:17 | wildintellect: | before discount is $17751 - I'll double check the spec, and send around the quote |
| 19:33:06 | crschmidt: | Thanks. |
| 19:48:01 | wildintellect: | sent, enjoy |
| 19:49:18 | wildintellect: | oops, attachment was too big, anyone a moderator and want to push it through |
| 19:50:07 | FrankW: | wildintellect: looking... |
| 19:50:31 | FrankW: | forwarded. |
| 19:55:29 | wildintellect: | anyone know what the hell HD Multi-Select for 1st hard drive means - I guessed in my email but I'm really not sure ( guess I can live chat the dell rep ) |
| 19:59:19 | FrankW: | Would it be silly to have a generic 1TB dumb ( non-RAID ) drive in one of the machines as extra low reliability but cheap disk space? |
| 19:59:34 | FrankW: | I'm a bit agog at the cost and limitations of the specialized server equiptment. |
| 20:00:02 | crschmidt: | FrankW: I think we would be better suited to have something like that at telascience. |
| 20:00:03 | wildintellect: | thats a good q, also should the 1st drive be non raid dedicated to the host OS, I've heard this makes things faster |
| 20:00:24 | wildintellect: | Right my grand idea is that telescience is the offsite backup |
| 20:00:45 | wildintellect: | amongst other roles it does |
| 20:01:53 | wildintellect: | looks like live chat with dell is a no go on linux |
| 20:02:24 | FrankW: | While telascience can serve for some offsite backup, it won't necessarily negate the value of having some additional local disk space ( IMHO ) |
| 20:03:44 | wildintellect: | the big machine will have 1 +TB in the RAID 6 |
| 20:04:00 | wildintellect: | 1.17TB to be more precise |
| 20:04:13 | FrankW: | yes, but touching that will be interfering with all the other disk access on the machine. |
| 20:04:26 | wildintellect: | I read up on that |
| 20:04:28 | FrankW: | Perhaps I'll hold this idea for later. |
| 20:04:36 | FrankW: | We would certainly be good for now. |
| 20:05:02 | wildintellect: | this kind of setup can handle a lot or requests at a time |
| 20:05:10 | FrankW: | One day, I'd still like to put in a cheapy $2K server with a couple TB. |
| 20:05:26 | FrankW: | yes, well, that's what they said about the peer1 servers to. |
| 20:05:31 | wildintellect: | agreed, that was an alternative in my mind |
| 20:05:33 | crschmidt: | Really? |
| 20:05:39 | FrankW: | But "pg_dump > abc.dump" still brings everything to near a standstill. |
| 20:05:50 | : | * crschmidt has never observed that peer1 servers are really designed for high load. |
| 20:06:05 | wildintellect: | buy 2 of the lower price and a 3rd that's just for HDs |
| 20:06:11 | FrankW: | When they were speced, they were supposedly fairly high performance servers. |
| 20:06:30 | wildintellect: | did you see the article I posted on RAID performance? |
| 20:06:34 | crschmidt: | At OSUOL or whatever, are we paying for bandwidth? |
| 20:06:46 | FrankW: | I did not read the article on raid, no. |
| 20:07:00 | FrankW: | crschmidt: that area seems vague. |
| 20:07:15 | FrankW: | I presume it is free until they notice we are using a lot at which point they may ask for some financing. |
| 20:07:21 | crschmidt: | Heh. Okay. |
| 20:07:39 | FrankW: | Anyways, I'm happy with the servers as speced. |
| 20:07:56 | FrankW: | It shouldn't be too hard to drop another server in the rack in 8 months if I want more disk space or something. |
| 20:08:09 | crschmidt: | Right. |
| 20:08:12 | wildintellect: | yes, and could be quite cheap with big SATA drives |